My Electric Brewery Build

[Ozbrewer]

@Garry - I got the wood from Brooks in Bluebell. For the top and the underneath shelf I'm looking at planed white wood (same type already used), they have planks 22mm x 200mm. I could do shorter width, but I like the idea of wider planks for some reason.

@Eoin - I had figured with the current strength and then adding the shelf and top it will further strengthen. I'm not a carpenter or engineer, and it is massively solid at the moment. Thanks for the advice though.

[Tom]

6x2 planed will be more than adequate across a 6ft span (sorry, you're not dragging me into the next century with your fancy millimeters). You could bathe your kids in the HLT and still it won't creak.

Nice purple wig, BTW.

[Shanna]

Hi OzBrewer

I was wondering if you have built your hlt yet? Will the 2*5.5kw be too much for a single vessel? I have a 50 litre kettle with one of these 5.5kw camco heating elements. I can get a full kettle upto boiling in under an hour and i am wondering whether you will need all the juice? I had an electrician fit the element using electrical junction boxes to house the wiring of the element and he used heavy duty steel sheathed guard cable. I find it works well but it is a tad cumbersome to move around..

Your hlt is going to have more wattage than a domestic electric shower. My basic uunderstanding is that most domestic supplies will only allow a single electric shower in a property as having two running at the same time would overload the power supply. I wonder have you considered what impact running your two 5.5kw elements will have on the rest of your property.

Shanna

PS: Don't forget your earths when doing the hlt.

[Ciderhead]

Thanks for the encouragement everyone.

The panel layout I have designed is below. I used a program called InkScape - www.inkscape.org - it's freeware, very simple to use, especially if I managed it. Although I used SESTOS pids in the layout diagram, the ones I actually have are the Auberins PIDs.

I will be running two elements in the HLT. I know this is controversial, but I am using the HLT as the HERMS, so two elements will give me the power and speed to ramp temperatures sufficiently. I just felt this was a simple solution and I realise I am trading increased power costs as a result. I'll have two 5500watt camco ULWD elements in the HLT. But the panel will be designed that if both elements in the HLT are on, the element in the BK can't be on. This keeps the functionality/capacity within the 63amp range and can't be exceeded. The panel will be 600mmx600mmx200mm.

Looks sexy
biggest issue you may have is responsiveness of the herms coil, in the US they all run their large coils through HLT and give it socks but this is subject to massive under and over runs even when you throw the kitchen sink at it in terms of juice
The uk brewers have all switched across to small coils in small boilers of the 2-8l size, asparagus pots, with elements and or lots using kettles on 25l set ups.
The theory behind this is that like a hot air ballon short shots of heat work better if you want more accurate control than a storage heater.
As well as responsive instant heat transfer this will also be influenced by power of your pump and ability to pass efficiently through your coil,
My advice here is save your pennies for a chugger or March pump.

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

Hi OzBrewer

I was wondering if you have built your hlt yet? Will the 2*5.5kw be too much for a single vessel? I have a 50 litre kettle with one of these 5.5kw camco heating elements. I can get a full kettle upto boiling in under an hour and i am wondering whether you will need all the juice? I had an electrician fit the element using electrical junction boxes to house the wiring of the element and he used heavy duty steel sheathed guard cable. I find it works well but it is a tad cumbersome to move around..

Your hlt is going to have more wattage than a domestic electric shower. My basic uunderstanding is that most domestic supplies will only allow a single electric shower in a property as having two running at the same time would overload the power supply. I wonder have you considered what impact running your two 5.5kw elements will have on the rest of your property.

Shanna

I reckon the second element is a back up, plus Mira showers are rated at 10kW, and operate ok on a 45Amp RCBO trip switch, if you switch one element one and toggle the other one on and off as required, then it should be fine, banging the 2 elements on at the same time to start with, might trip the breaker

PS: Don't forget your earths when doing the hlt.

[Ozbrewer]

Ok - to answer the questions on the HLT and the power draw.

Firstly, this rig is being modelled on the Electric Brewery by Kal. I'm sure most people here are familiar with this.

I want to be able to step mash, and I want steps to occur fairly rapidly. I want the rig to be built also to be capable of back to back brews. So in a single day, I could do a lager with steps, and then follow with an ale.

To be able to do a double batch lager, with say 55 litres at end of boil, I want to be able to bring the HLT water up to step temps in as short a time as possible - hence the two elements.

My brother-in-law is an electrician by trade, and his friend is a domestic electrician, and I have another friend who is also a domestic electrician. So, after having asked all of them the same question ad nauseam, the recommendation is a sub-board off the main fuse. The sub-board will be rated to 63amps. I don't have an electric heating shower, our hot water is heated via our gas boiler. The shower unit I have has a pump, but I don't believe that will draw much power in amps. The only other things I run are two fridges, the tv, computer and lights.

So, after looking at the amp usage against all that and having the brewery run, I shouldn't trip anything....provided of course there is no dishwasher, washing machine or drier running at the same time. I have an understanding wife and with some prior planning, I should be able to avoid any conflict regarding these things.  :.  I mostly brew on Saturday or Sunday day time when these things aren't in use anyway.

Regarding the over/under-runs and stable temperatures. This should not be a problem. With a properly designed system with proper components it won't be an issue. I'm using Auber PIDs. The PIDs, once tuned, will control the elements in such a way that they will maintain a stable and accurate temperature of the liquid that they are controlling; this is due to the algorithm built into the PID that will monitor temp rises and turn the elements on and off automatically is it gets closer to target and whilst at target. In this instance, a PID will control the water in the HLT, and the wort will pass through the coil for heating. The coil is 50' in length. The water in the HLT will be circulated to prevent stratification. I have two (chugger) pumps, one for wort and one for water in the HLT. The pumps will run continuously during the brewing process. The temp probe on the HLT will be on the water output valve. The wort on exit of the HERMS coil, due to its length, will exit at the temperature of the HLT water. The other additional factor is the false bottom in the MT. For this I have a blichmann false bottom, and all reports on this say I can run the pumps full open to achieve maximum flow and recirculation of the wort, without sticking the mash. This is tried and tested on many systems following the Electric Brewery model.

On reading all the threads on the Electric Brewery website, HBT and even AHB, those people that are getting fluctuating temperatures have one of the following problems: not tuned the PID, not using a PID, having the temp probe at the wrong location, wrong size HERMS coil (diameter or length) or having a faulty temp probe, amongst others. The above setup does provide a stable temperature approach.

I know that in UK and Ireland it's popular to build a small separate heat exchange for the HERMS. I didn't want to go down this route. I know it works, I know it is probably cheaper in terms of cost of running. I wanted a system that was pretty straight forward and fairly contained. With this system, it means I have three kettles to manage. I know it might seem petty but I felt building a fourth kettle (regardless of size) into the process was more than I wanted to do. I liked the idea of the Electric Brewery so went down that path. Many ways to skin a cat I guess......

The elements will be housed in junction boxes, exactly like on the electric brewery. I really didn't want to go this way, but in the long run, felt it would be easier just to copy what has already been done. This way the elements will be grounded appropriately as well.
Having so many electricians around to vet the rig should ensure that is safe and viable.

Below are the photos of the Chugger pumps I have. I hope this helps explain the system a little better.

[Shanna]

Hi Oz Brewer

Good idea to get the sparks relative to check your plans. I would be interested to see that boiler with 2 * 5.5 kw elements on the go. I have one of these & its a beast. I can imagine with two of them going it's going to be interesting. I would recommend insulating you hlt well.

Any hints re details of where, how much etc re the chugger pump?

Shanna

[Ozbrewer]

@Shanna - I bought direct from chugger pumps. I think about 145 US. Can't remember shipping, but I think it was like 50/60 US, could be less. I didn't get stung for duty either which was good. I have an email floating around some where as I think the actual company is "something" pumps, can't remember the exact name. PM if you want and I'll dig it out.

The other option you have, if you are interested in them is buy off a reseller, just check to make sure they are 240v version, and use www.shipito.com to ship to Ireland.

[Ozbrewer]

So, all my shiny fittings arrived. Well not all exactly, but the bulk. Still waiting on sight glasses and hop filter from homebrewbuilder in the UK.

I did get stung 60 euro by DHL for customs. I ordered these last week, possibly Tuesday, from Stainless Brewing in the US, got it sent to my Shipito address, and they processed within 18 hours I think, and DHL got all over to Ireland for today. I paid 90US dollars in shipping with DHL - package weight was 25.5lbs. approx. 11.5kg.

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

Looks like a Garda arms find from back in the day :-) or stainless porn !!

Sent from my ST26i using Tapatalk

[DEMPSEY]

Looks great. Whats the 3 90Deg and 2 135Deg 12mm pipes for.

[Ozbrewer]

@Dempsey - 90 and 45 degree tubes are for kettle pick-ups and BK return and HLT water return. I may actually have one tube too many, but that's ok.

In the BK, I will chill via a counterflow and return back to the BK until wort is down to pitching temp. That's the intent anyway. 

[DEMPSEY]

Tis what I do. Return wort via the counterflow until temp is at pitching temp then re direct to FV.

[Ozbrewer]

It's all moving really fast now. I think I said in my OP I started in March last year, but looking through the purchase history it was actually February.

Anyway, the brother-in-law was over tonight with the panel. I've taken photos as per usual.

The thing is bloody huge, and very heavy. I weighed it in at 20.2kg

We did the basic lay out and have worked out all the distances between the components etc. Hopefully on Thursday we will measure it all out again with a proper square, mark it up and then we can start cutting. I estimate this will take the good part of April to get done due to our own commitments.

[DEMPSEY]

This is going to be awesome