Brewing Water

[Padraic]

A nice approachable guide to brewing water has popped up in the wiki, check it out!

I've always been a fan of let the water look after itself but after reading this article I think I might give it a go.

http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.com/wiki/doku.php?id=water_for_brewing

I wouldn't be myself if I couldn't find something to confuse me but at what point does the CRS get added? Just before the mash I presume?

Great work Brian!

[Padraic]

I stuck in a table to make the type's stand out a bit better... Is it possible to get the info on other styles of beer? I know the normal bases are covered but it would be good to get a few more examples in there.

[Dr Jacoby]

"Carrying on the example of the Pale Ale, you had tap water to start with that had some calcium in it and when you adjusted it, you lost some".

I might be misunderstanding you here, but if you mean that by adding CRS you lose calcium then this is incorrect. CRS actually adds calcium. Check out this short article on the Brupaks site, especially the "adjustment of calcium levels" section.

I think it's also important to mention that one of the easiest ways to improve brewing water is to get rid of the chlorine content. This can be done by adding half a campden tablet to the mash water and another half to the sparge water.

Also, it is worth remembering that nearly half of the calcium that gets added to the mash will remain behind after sparging, so I would add some more to the boil, along with magnesium and salt, if needed.

Tom, one of the brewers behind Trouble Brewing, wrote some good blog posts on these issues a few years back. Here are some links that might be of interest:

http://blackcatbrewery.blogspot.ie/2009/08/calcium.html

http://blackcatbrewery.blogspot.ie/2009/09/hardness-and-alkalinity-part-1.html

http://blackcatbrewery.blogspot.ie/2008/11/water-water-everywhere.html

[DEMPSEY]

The upgrades are much better now,thanks padraic,helps to further make it a simple read.
I did not write about other additions in this article as it is intended to lay the ground work as a basis for understanding water treatment. I find so many brewers find this area confusing and read alot and then dont get it. perhaps a further article can follow for when a brewer feels he or she has got it. :-/

[Will_D]

I might be misunderstanding you here, but if you mean that by adding CRS you lose calcium then this is incorrect. CRS actually adds calcium.

The exact composition and nature of CRS seems to be elusive (well I can't find out exactly what it is or does, so
my google skills may be lacking).

But, we do know it's an acid (or blend) and it appears to contain sodium, and we do know that it precipitates out the carbonate and bicarbonate from the calcium carbonate and calcium bicarbonate (which are alkaline). Presumably it forms sodium carbonate & bicarbonate, and this is what precipitates. So what becomes of the calcium?

So back to the sodium in the CRS... What's the other side of the sodium in the CRS, as this will end up bonding with the calcium?

Both sodium carbonate and bicarbonate are water soluble they they won't precipitate!!

Now for the chemistry:

Acid + Carbonate = A Salt + CO2

So base ( calcium carbonate ) + acid ( sulphuric ) yields CO2 and calcium sulphate ( soluble )

Remember CRS stands for Carbonate Reducing Solution (IIRC)

HTH

Will

[Will_D]

It passes through you. Afaik CRS does not precipitate out anything

Will

[DEMPSEY]

found this on a thread, a breakdown of what is in DLS,
0.95g/L of DLS adds:
172ppm Calcium Ca
5.2ppm Magnesium Mg
71.5ppm Sodium Na
169ppm Chloride Cl
353ppm Sulphate SO4

Sodium Chloride 19%
Calcium Chloride 13%
Calcium Sulphate 62%
Magnesium Sulphate 5%

[Will_D]

CRS actually adds calcium.

I've been trying to find reference to this Peter, but I can't. Are you sure it adds Calcium, as opposed to not removing it?

AFIK; CRS stands for "Carbonate Reducing Solution/Stuff/Salts

It is meant to reduce hardness ( calcium and magnessium carbonates ) by acidifying the water (see previous post for the chemistry).

Calcium is highly desirable to the yeasties that's why we use calcium aditives like calcium chloride and calcium sulphate to modify the mouth feel.

Will

[DEMPSEY]

researching what is in CRS this has come to light. AMS and CRS are the same product sold under different names.

[Dr Jacoby]

CRS actually adds calcium.

I've been trying to find reference to this Peter, but I can't. Are you sure it adds Calcium, as opposed to not removing it?

I think I read about it on Jim's Beerkit. About half way down this article the author talks about CRS reducing alkalinity and adding chloride and sulphate. This might be what I was thinking of.  :-/

[DEMPSEY]

The breakdown of CRS,
250ml CRS is,
198ml water,
39ml hydro,
13ml sulphuric
- giving 65ppm cl+ per 1ml/L & 88ppm so4+

[Jacob]

Are those the 'chemicals' that you mentioned?

DLS & CRS

[Eoin]

Yes.

I have CRS but I don't like using it. It has taken all the chrome (or whatever it is) off the element in my boiler.

That's a good thing really with the boiler, it does mean that you element is not covered in limescale and becoming very inefficient.

I do wonder how it would do that though if you're using it correctly.....

[Eoin]

I left it overnight, but I think I may have put too much in (as you alluded to!), but then again I was sort of flying blind at the time, and didn't know how hard the water was.

Ah ok, you need to do a water test and then just leave it a short while to off-gas. I have hard water and I was using about 40ml on 75l of water, very approximately.

You really must have an aquarium test kit to use it properly.

[Jacob]

We've tested water in Swords (Ridgewood) y-day.
Result we got is 150 ppm.