I've never kegged, and aren't keen to start.
It would be nice, though, to have tap homebrew occasionally for a BBQ or whatever.
So yesterday I saw one of these in a hipster cafe being used for self-service tap water.
My first thought was, "Could I bottle in that?"
So... could I?
- Would it work to siphon into, prime it, seal it up, and then serve from the spigot?
- Are the seals at the top and in the spigot tight enough to keep it from getting infected?
- The biggest bottle I routinely see is 1.5L - would you need added yeast to condition 2 gallons?
Yeah, this is a bit out there, but for anyone who hates washing, think how nice it would be to fit a whole batch into just 2 "bottles"!
No.
That ain't designed for beer pressure. (Kombucha Tea is probably fine).
Really?
Mason jar glass is thick enough to tolerate pressure canning. Is that not also thick enough for secondary fermentation pressure?
That is not designed to withstand carbonation pressures,if the glass does not crack the tap could blow out.I f you are going to turn this into a pressure barrel you may as well get a corny keg and do it safely. ;D
The glass may be thick but it's a very large surface area that will crack a lot easier.
Consider a small pane of glass. it's nice and solid and you could break your hand punching it.
but if you have a larger pane of the same thickness you can smash it by leaning against it.
The equation is F=P*A, force = pressure by area.
If the pressure is say 10pounds per square inch and your small bottle has 10 square inches surface area, you have 100 lbs of force
With the same pressure and a larger bottle of 50 square inches, you have 500 lbs of force
So even though you have the same pressure in both bottles, you've 5 times the force on the walls of the larger vessel.
Would you consider using mini-kegs?
https://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/beer-wine-equipment-minikeg-systems-c-2_95.html
I'm not 100% sure on the whole structural thing but I think mason jars are designed to withstand negative pressure (vacuums) and not positive pressure.
That's just dangerous, valve will probably blow first, but not worth the risk :(
Quote from: LordEoin on June 26, 2015, 03:40:56 PM
The glass may be thick but it's a very large surface area that will crack a lot easier.
Consider a small pane of glass. it's nice and solid and you could break your hand punching it.
but if you have a larger pane of the same thickness you can smash it by leaning against it.
The equation is F=P*A, force = pressure by area.
If the pressure is say 10pounds per square inch and your small bottle has 10 square inches surface area, you have 100 lbs of force
With the same pressure and a larger bottle of 50 square inches, you have 500 lbs of force
So even though you have the same pressure in both bottles, you've 5 times the force on the walls of the larger vessel.
We sell those things but I haven't checked the spec on them.
Second LE on this. We also sell large Speidel Stainless Steel fermentation tanks, and it would be nice to pressurize them to help kegging. Not possible though, even a few PSI can rupture them. The bigger the vessel the worse the problem is. That's why large bright beer tanks are crazy expensive.
Quote from: irish_goat on June 26, 2015, 04:13:15 PM
I'm not 100% sure on the whole structural thing but I think mason jars are designed to withstand negative pressure (vacuums) and not positive pressure.
The negative pressure they experience is negligible. It's only the vacuum of the liquid that's been left out and once the pressure of the weight of the liquid mass at the point of the tap has been counteracted by the vacuum it'll just stop pouring until an air bubble gets sucked up the tap or the seal is broken on the top.
But you're right, most jars are designed to bow outwards to withstand negative pressure. Jams etc are poured hot into a hot jar and sealed, and when the jam cools it creates a vacuum. You hear a loud pop after a while when this happens. It's the pressure test on the cap 'imploding'. The same thing that pops when you open a fresh jar and equalize the pressure.
That almost made me sound clever!
They're really designed for flat liquids like water or ribena for example (http://st.houzz.com/simgs/0f91d48b029cbec4_4-4166/traditional-beverage-dispensers.jpg) , but you could fill it and use it like a pitcher with a tap. It'd keep flies out etc.
It would look nice, but the longer it's left on the table serving the flatter it'll get (but probably a bit slower than a pitcher).
Anyway, I digress... Back to the original questions:
- Could I bottle in that? - Yes, but it will most likely result in a giant bottle bomb, a dead dog, a blind child and a sticky bloody carpet.
- Would it work to siphon into, prime it, seal it up, and then serve from the spigot? - Yes, so long as you don't give it time to carbonate you could have some delicious flat sugary beerish stuff. But you'd need to keep it in the fridge at all times (or open) or it will build pressure and crack or explode.
- Are the seals at the top and in the spigot tight enough to keep it from getting infected? - yes, that's what they're designed for.
- The biggest bottle I routinely see is 1.5L - would you need added yeast to condition 2 gallons? - No, the beer:sugar:yeast ration will be remain regardless of what you put it in.
Ps: if i haven't been clear, DO NOT USE A KILNER OR MASON JAR TO CARBONATE IN OR YOU WILL GET AIDS, DIE AND GET ABUSED BY SATAN.
Oh, and point 2: Don't store beer in clear class. Has to be in brown glass, cans or kegs only.
(Homework: Lightstruck beer)
I have seen something like this here in the town . its a lot larger 5-ltr maybe ,with thicker glass and squared not round .
i was thinking of using it for plum/damson wine later this year , that`s if they have any of the large ones left . even then you`d prob be wise to use it purely as a way of letting your friends help themselves . if they dont drink beer well they can pick up a glass and work away . then scrub it clean and put it back in the cupboard again til it`s needed .
I would take the advice offered here .glass is bad news man . the last thing you want is something like this under a lot of pressure . it could sit for ages looking like it`s grand . but give it a light tap by mistake and you could have beer and glass all over the shop . I`v sliced my knuckle off just cleaning a regular pint glass. and iv seen the godson (who works in my local ) drop a glass .a chunk of it bounced right back up and sliced the top half of his index finger wide open . trust me he`d much rather have been working in the pub on a saturday night than sat in A&E for hrs .
Good reality checks, plus lots of good info about pressure I didn't know before, so worth asking in the end.
Thanks, all.