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Guinness Extra Stout Recipe - Paging Dempsey

Started by biertourist, February 02, 2024, 08:03:00 PM

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biertourist

February 02, 2024, 08:03:00 PM Last Edit: February 02, 2024, 08:58:20 PM by biertourist
Can anyone share a good grist for a Guinness Extra Stout clone?

I know Dempsey and Nigel advocate for 70/20/10 Pale/Flaked/Roast and 3% acidulated if you want the sour note, for standard Guinness but I'm assuming that you don't just equally scale the ingredients with the move to Extra Stout gravity (I'd guess that the Pale % increases with extra, but it's only a guess)...

Do you go with even MORE acid malt for the move to Extra Stout?  I vaguely recall ancient discussions that Extra Stout's pH was even lower vs. Standard Guinness and I'm not clear if this just comes from a lager quantity of Roast barley, or if it's coming from the elusive possible acidification?


Adam

biertourist

If I have the beer statistics right:
5.6% ABV
47 IBUs
45 SRM


Playing around with a few grists, and trying to hit the numbers above, even with an approx 700 SRM quite dark roast barley and using a 2 SRM Pale base malt, it seems that Extra Stout would need more than 10% Roast barley to hit 45 SRM. (The color increases faster than the strength vs. standard Guinness, so it would seem that the % of Roast Barley needs to, also...)

66.7% Pale (2.0 SRM) -I'm assuming they're still using the Cork Stout malt
20% Flaked Barley (1.7 SRM)
13.3% Crisp Roast Barley @ (696.6 SRM) -definitely on the dark side

I ended up with:

OG: 1.057
FG: 1.014
ABV: 5.62%
IBU: 46.5%
SRM: 45.2%



Seems reasonable enough to me, anyone argue for any changes? (I'd pull 3% of the basemalt and replace with acidulated, and doubt it will change the color.)


Thanks,

Adam

biertourist

Update: I recently switched to the Grainfather tool and am getting very strange results out of it vs. BeerSmith on wort color.

BeerSmith says 70/20/10 Pale/Flaked/Roast scaled up to 1.056 OG and 5.6% ABV with a dark roast barley like Crisp does indeed result in a 45 SRM beer.


Adam

phildo79

Personally, I wouldn't be overly concerned with hitting the SRM bang on. Could you do something like 8% roasted barley and 2% black patent?

DEMPSEY

on the 70 20 10, I did 70% pale, 20% flaked, 7% roast, 3% acidulated. Was happy with the result. At the time, I used Maryanka hops (Polish) to bitter.
Dei miscendarum discipulus
Forgive us our Hangovers as we forgive those who hangover against us

biertourist

Quote from: DEMPSEY on February 22, 2024, 11:10:41 AMon the 70 20 10, I did 70% pale, 20% flaked, 7% roast, 3% acidulated. Was happy with the result. At the time, I used Maryanka hops (Polish) to bitter.


Thanks! Hope you're well.


I ended up brewing a variation of my Stanard Plain stout on Saturday, instead.
69% Golden Promise
18% Flaked Barley
10.7% Roast Grains total split between:4/6ths Roast Barley, 1/6th Pale Chocolate, 1/6th Black Patent
2.5% Crystal 40

A little bit of CaCl and Gypsym in the mash and 88% lactic to get the mash to 5.4 pH at the beginning then 5.3 at the end.  I saved all the roast grains for the last 10 minutes of the mash, per the method that Martin Brungard recommended. 

1.047 OG this time. Tasted like it had a bit too much hop bitterness in the wort; I just moved to using a Grainfather G40 (2nd brew with it) and I forgot that I get higher utilization on this system vs. my old system that I used a Hop Spider on.


I actually just picked up a 4 pack of the O'hara's Irish Stout in nitro cans for my homebrew club to try at our meeting next Tuesday, so that they can try an Irish Craft example. It was $24 for 4 cans; I was NOT prepared for that, but the club's paying for it, at least.



-First time I've tried that. I brew it a bit bigger than it probably should be at 1.047.

I'm going to wait to see what the pH naturally finishes at and I play to acidify the finished beer to at least 4.0, or maybe take it down to a Guinness-like 3.9pH.  I'm afraid the black patent / chocolate malt might get too harsh / astringent all the way down at 3.9...



Adam

DEMPSEY

Not a Guinness recipe addition, but Brown malt can be great in a stout.
Dei miscendarum discipulus
Forgive us our Hangovers as we forgive those who hangover against us

DEMPSEY

Rye River Eventide Irish stout recipeis;
Malts
Brown Malt, Carafa Special II, Chocolate Malt, Pale Malt, Torrefied Barley
Hops
Columbus
ABV 4.5%
Dei miscendarum discipulus
Forgive us our Hangovers as we forgive those who hangover against us