Hi guys. I've just bought new fermenters so I have a couple of old fermenters and a carboy that i'm not really using anymore and was thinking of using them to make a couple of lambics (maybe a kriek and a framboise) and I've a few questions.
Mash as normal?
Boil using old hops?(I've a freezer full of them)
I just add regular sacch for primary fermentation right?
After primary finishes, I add in pedio AND brett at the same time, or a combo yeast?
Rack onto fruit after ~6 months?
Age for another ~6?
Am I missing anything
Not an expert but
why add hops at all, even aged hops? They'll only inhibit souring and any aroma/flavour won't compliment.
Adding the Brett & Bacteria straight away is supposed to speed up souring & funk
just something I saw in the Cantillon brewery recently but that also could have something to do with their open air fermentation
Quote from: Simon_ on January 24, 2016, 05:48:28 PM
Not an expert but
why add hops at all, even aged hops? They'll only inhibit souring and any aroma/flavour won't compliment.
Adding the Brett & Bacteria straight away is supposed to speed up souring & funk
I'm no expert but I've been reading Michael Tonsmeire's book American Sour Beers recently. Hops are added for bittering to between 10 and 15IBU. Aged hops are added to lambics as they allow for a higher hopping rate without increasing bitterness. This provides more anti microbial protection against some bugs during spontaneous fermentation, in particular heat tolerant lacto strains which could lower ph too quickly and inhibit sacchromyces before it completes fermentation. Aged hops don't seem to be required if pitching culture of Brewers yeast and microbes.
Mash as normal, you could attempt a turbid mash but there's really no need....even better just use all dry malt. Pitch your brewers yeast and bugs together. I honestly think you'll get a better beer. On my lambic I fermented with us-05 and then added the roeselare mix...it's shit. My Rodenbach clone I added wlp-530 and the yeast bays sour mix at the same time....it's turning out to be a fantastic beer.
If you do use the Roeselare blend don't be disappointed with the sourness level. It's famous for being much sourer after a few generations while quite weak in its first go round.
Also add the dregs from a few commercial sours. My next "lambic" will use my new "house culture" ha! Basically I've built up cantillion, 3 fontaine, boon, GB and a few others.
Quote from: armedcor on January 24, 2016, 09:21:04 PM
Mash as normal, you could attempt a turbid mash but there's really no need....even better just use all dry malt. Pitch your brewers yeast and bugs together. I honestly think you'll get a better beer. On my lambic I fermented with us-05 and then added the roeselare mix...it's shit. My Rodenbach clone I added wlp-530 and the yeast bays sour mix at the same time....it's turning out to be a fantastic beer.
If you do use the Roeselare blend don't be disappointed with the sourness level. It's famous for being much sourer after a few generations while quite weak in its first go round.
Also add the dregs from a few commercial sours. My next "lambic" will use my new "house culture" ha! Basically I've built up cantillion, 3 fontaine, boon, GB and a few others.
I plan on using wlp655 on one and Wyeast 3278 on the other together with us05
If you pitched your bugs and yeast together, did you rack it off the yeast cake at all or leave it all in primary fermentation?
Mash high to allow the max residual sugars in the wort. This will be food for the bugs later. I've mash hopped with old hops and put none in the boil. Boil at least 90 mins.
You can ferment with a clean yeast then add brett. This will drop the FG a bit lower before you add the bugs. If you pitch the bugs at the same time the ph will drop low before the brett has time to do its thing.
Add your bug of choice and forget about it for 6-8 months. The longer the better. Keep the fermenter somewhere warm to help speed things up.
What i generally do then is rack the sour into demi's containing fruit and leave for another 6 months to age.
After 6 months rack again to another demi to let sit again for another few weeks to make sure there is no sugar left that could cause bottle bombs.
Get another mash on the go and use the bug cake from the last batch for the next one.
The thing about sours is they take so long to do you should have one on the go all the time.
Hope this helps.