As some of you are aware from this (http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1353845636) thread, I've tried my hand at malting my own grain.
The most annoying part of that was drying the grain, so I've been thinking of building a grain dryer.
At first, I was just thinking of building something where I could spread out the grain on sheets of some sort of mesh, and pass air over them.
Then I figured that this probably wouldn't be enough, so I started thinking of some sort of heating system.
But to maintain the temperature at the right level with any sort of efficiency, it'd need to be an enclosed system.
But then build up of humidity would be a problem, so I'd need to add some sort of dehumidifier.
Am I overthinking this?
Does anyone know of any simple DIY solution?
I think BrenMurph said he malts his own grain.
Or maybe he just toasted it a bit.
I remember some youtube videos of an ozzy guy malting it using a modified dishwasher.
I do remember him having it spread out all ove r the floor though too waiting for it to germanate (?)
This might be an interesting project for malting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-41wQHHi0o
When I first tried home malting I used the tumble drier as a drier (Theres a clue in the name!!)
Put the wet grain, about a kilo into a pillow case, tie off the end
Repeat for about 3 or 4 pillow cases or whatever.
Set the drier to low, and put a temp sensor thermistor from and STC or ATC or chepo digital thermometer in the air out duct.
Depending on the load will take about 2 or 3 hours to dry.
How do you know when its dry?
Mark a pillow, weigh it, record weight, after some time weigh again, and again etc. when weight loss is getting constant then its dry!
If you exceed the desired temp knock the drier onto cool.
The pillow cases contain most of the dust, the sprouts get rubbed off and the resulting malt is ready for next stage - mashing or roasting
BTW: The smell in the house is FANTASTIC! Just make sure the misses likes malt!! I'm lucky mine loves it!!
Love the concept, nice one Will, does it eat malt like my socks?
You could have malty smelling smalls :)
QuoteLove the concept, nice one Will, does it eat malt like my socks?
You could have malty smelling smalls :)
No way Hosséé 4 bags in, 4 bags out.
Now if you want a Munich Beer Hall malt then the odd Leder Hossen und Socken may just help ;)
The only problem with my home malting of wheat and barley to make a Hefeweissen was that the HW was not particularly great. So when the group buys started I decided that the amount of effort and leckky was not worth it.
But come the great disaster scenario this doomsday prepper is ready to go! Just need to get a bigger anti-gouger deterant (best not say ass. rfle!!)
I heard about the tumble dryer solution, but I be a bit reluctant to try that. The dryer in my house is old, and was there before I moved in, and it was absolutely filthy. I spent 2 hours cleaning it before I'd even put my clothes in it, and I still don't really like using it. I'm not going to put grain in it.
Would this (http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1359641377) work?
QuoteWould this (http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1359641377) work?
I doubt it. I assume that its a cool dehydrator?
Malted base grains (keeping the enzymes ) need to be dried up to about 50 or 60 C
I think?
eerh 78! tried to cook Dempsey Tub and me today in a hot air drier, and the freaky thing is leave you coat on as it insulates you from the heat!!
Quoteeerh 78! tried to cook Dempsey Tub and me today in a hot air drier, and the freaky thing is leave you coat on as it insulates you from the heat!!
I think that at 78C the phrase is "render down"
the only thing being rendered was the fat on our arses.
As Ciderhead said,78c,IT WAS BLOODY HOT. We went in to the drying area and there was 10% moisture still in the grain,needs to get down to around 3%. So the heat was still on at 78C. I cannot remember if I ever experienced that level of heat but our tour guide seemed non too bothered about it.He wore a big jacket and seemed content to let us cook as he was giving us detailed facts about the procedure. Tube went to remove his jacket and he said not to as you would cook even quicker,when he suggested we could go back outside again,you never saw such a sorry lot as us not being polite about who goes out the door first. :-[
From what I understand, 50 - 60C would be way too high for drying. I think it needs to be between 30 - 40C. Then the temperature is upped to kiln the malt. The temperature of kilning depends on the type of malt you want.
QuoteFrom what I understand, 50 - 60C would be way too high for drying. I think it needs to be between 30 - 40C. Then the temperature is upped to kiln the malt. The temperature of kilning depends on the type of malt you want.
I would love to see you writing this on your tablet while on a visit to the kiln like us yesterday :D :D. I dont recall any of the facts he was telling us while we were in there :'(
Sounds hot. Where exactly were you?
And don't take any of what I say as fact. That's just what I came across while searching the web about it, and as we all know, sometimes the internet lies!
Jaysus yas kept that little trip quiet lasd!! :P
I wanna go do the next pick up :)
QuoteGerminating the barley. It stays in here for 5 days.
Temperature at the bottom was 16, air is forced through from bottom up, and temperature at the top is 19 as obviously grain germenation generates heat!
The arm doesn't move the ENTIRE floor rotates :o
QuoteThat was actually the kiln we were in.
crappity smack me was it hot. I've never experienced anything like it in my life.
Vital stats 36 24 32 no not that kind as obviously tube and dempsey still have their tongues hanging out and eyeballs on stalks. Nothing proprietary here btw.
Gas and electricity bill runs to 7 figures every year and yes they do use heat exchangers
Each Grain silos out the back hold between 500 and 750mt, there are 12
Plant runs 365 days of the year
Entire operation run by staff of 12
Walls of kiln 1.5 metres thick
Heat transfer mechanism used with superheated steam at 138 degrees c to kiln rather than direct gas
Process is totally chemical free just local water a proprietary part is recirculated
Air also mixed with percentage of external air
Run at night for cheaper energy costs
Entire process totally automated and can run on its own unattended!
Significant quantiies of product already heading to homebrewers in US currently in Bulk and rebagged over there. This will be done in Cork at some point.
Makes you proud to be Irish seeing an operation like this producing premier product,
Can't wait to make my first true Irish grain PA.
QuoteQuoteFrom what I understand, 50 - 60C would be way too high for drying. I think it needs to be between 30 - 40C. Then the temperature is upped to kiln the malt. The temperature of kilning depends on the type of malt you want.
When we were in the kiln the malt was being cured as far as I remember. Not sure exactly what that means. But it was seriously hot and hard to breath.
The grain entering the kiln has high moisture content, they commence drying at 30 rising up to max 78-80 increasing slowly and drawing off the moisture over 2-3 days.
I had been exposed to 50 in the Middle East before, this was 78 but at force 5 that was so hot you had to turn your back to it to protect your face.
From initial wash to finished grain takes between 7-8 days depending on the specification
so.. about 2 - 3 years ago I looked into home brewing an d thought - nah its a bit advanced for me - then about a year or so ago found out a work buddy was into it - he brought me to his house one night for an extract brew and we went to the homebrewcompanies AG demo and I came away from that hooked - then went onto beoir and from beoir to here and club meetings -
since then I have upped my game to kegging and from daily browsing of this site - things have become normalised for me to the point that it seems absolutley reasonable to get a fridge - drill the crap out of it and stick taps on the door
it wasn't until I brought a keg to my mates party and poured pints to comments of thats quiet a serious set up, tha I reaslised how normalised this hobby (obession) has become for me - but I have to say from reading this post alone, you guys are nucking futs !! I love it !!
when is the NBHC National Club tour being organised !!!
Well all I can say is 'T'anks a nothing' for not inviting the club photographer/chemist/bio chemical nerdy grandad/one who has home malted/one who just "lourves" hot steamy places(!!!)/etc.
However back to reality!, probably could not have got the day off from the Missess.
Full Fecking marks tho' to the 3 of ye brave soldiers of the revolution in Irish Home Brewing for building a MAJOR bridge head into a local Irish supllier.
Now, once they have established the bagging line for the base malts :),
We pop down again for the 25 kg bags ( but I would prefer they do 10 or 12.5 kg bags as they get used quicker and hence fresher )
And then we hit them with a suggestion:
Our Will has a "tricked-up" tumble drier that can roast and toast malts and make all sorts off speciality (non diastatic) malts!
So how about a "Cara-Cork" or a "Roasted Liscarroll Chocholate Malt"
"We can but Dream"
I would like them to malt local Wheat and Rye as well!!
Sure If ye' don't asl ye' don't get
QuoteQuoteThat was actually the kiln we were in.
crappity smack me was it hot. I've never experienced anything like it in my life.
Vital stats 36 24 32 no not that kind as obviously tube and dempsey still have their tongues hanging out and eyeballs on stalks. Nothing proprietary here btw.
Gas and electricity bill runs to 7 figures every year and yes they do use heat exchangers
Each Grain silos out the back hold between 500 and 750mt, there are 12
Plant runs 365 days of the year
Entire operation run by staff of 12
Walls of kiln 1.5 metres thick
Heat transfer mechanism used with superheated steam at 138 degrees c to kiln rather than direct gas
Process is totally chemical free just local water a proprietary part is recirculated
Air also mixed with percentage of external air
Run at night for cheaper energy costs
Entire process totally automated and can run on its own unattended!
Significant quantiies of product already heading to homebrewers in US currently in Bulk and rebagged over there. This will be done in Cork at some point.
Makes you proud to be Irish seeing an operation like this producing premier product,
Can't wait to make my first true Irish grain PA.
Ciderhead and Tube listened carefully to the facts and stats while I watched all the lovely shiny things spinning around and around and ooh look at this swivelly thing. :D
[/quote]
QuoteQuoteQuoteThat was actually the kiln we were in.
crappity smack me was it hot. I've never experienced anything like it in my life.
Vital stats 36 24 32 no not that kind as obviously tube and dempsey still have their tongues hanging out and eyeballs on stalks. Nothing proprietary here btw.
Gas and electricity bill runs to 7 figures every year and yes they do use heat exchangers
Each Grain silos out the back hold between 500 and 750mt, there are 12
Plant runs 365 days of the year
Entire operation run by staff of 12
Walls of kiln 1.5 metres thick
Heat transfer mechanism used with superheated steam at 138 degrees c to kiln rather than direct gas
Process is totally chemical free just local water a proprietary part is recirculated
Air also mixed with percentage of external air
Run at night for cheaper energy costs
Entire process totally automated and can run on its own unattended!
Significant quantiies of product already heading to homebrewers in US currently in Bulk and rebagged over there. This will be done in Cork at some point.
Makes you proud to be Irish seeing an operation like this producing premier product,
Can't wait to make my first true Irish grain PA.
Ciderhead and Tube listened carefully to the facts and stats while I watched all the lovely shiny things spinning around and around and ooh look at this swivelly thing. :D
[/quote]
I did remember all the stats for amounts of air and their costs but not appropriate I post them on a public website.
Not sure where you got the 35 tonnes, with each batch 2 days in the kiln, thats only 6kt per annum, the number was 250-300Mt per kiln batch and we had err ...0.0001% of that couple of days run :)
From small acorns :)
QuoteTheir output is 30,000 mt p/a. Were we told 250-300 mt per batch or are you working back to that figure?
We weren't told it but batch size was written on the QC sheet before we went onto kiln, and there were 4 other entries there, nuff talk now about their specifics as its proprietary info and not for public domain.
:-X
Quoteyou guys are nucking futs !! I love it !!
!!!
Why thank you,we do try so hard,N.B. Can I call apon you in the future as a court witness should I break some silly rule or so,it is a defence that I would like to use and having a witness stand up and give testomy
such as yours would help sway a judge in my favour. :)
;D
hey Dempsey - stick me up as a defense witness and they'll throw away the key on ya before I even say a word !!!!!