Have a look at this 3 minute video by "The Range" who are the company who provide the "Make your own Beer kits.
There is no dought these kits are excellent, but their video has pretty poor errors if we want to produce quality beer.
Especially for the newer, less experienced brewers who are just getting going its not as simple as 1,2,3
Challenge:
spot the fatal errors in the video, there are several and have a debate about it, if ye dont come up with a gud few I and others will help you out, I'm sure.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=QFnYQHIlxhQ
enjoy the lesson :)
[Edit: post removed owing to being too quick of the mark. :( ]
come on John give the newbies a chance! >:(
theres about 10 more! did u see him dipping his glass into the open fermenter to see if its nice? :)
come on lads its a great lesson on how to not make homebrew from the 'experts' get stuck in and have a bash at bashing them.....and then ye all take onboard what we learned and make much better beer (and wine, cider, watever else)
The dip was covered under sanitation after fermentation, as was the suck on the siphon.
Quote from: johnrm on May 10, 2013, 09:01:39 PM
The dip was covered under sanitation after fermentation, as was the suck on the siphon.
luked more like he was practicing his weed smoking on the siphon, plenty of time for his germs to transfer to the beer :)
I've done the 'direct syphon' method and it's fine IMO if you turn off flow and let spigot sit in starsan for a while. Not had a problem yet.
Let's get principles right. Practice follows
Teach a man to fish....
My main problem is with his hipster watch! (and the generally vague quantities, times and sanitation)
Yes we can get the flow going then dip the end in boiling water or starsan :) the fella in the video didnt!
so on this point:
I feel theres absolutly no need to suck on the siphon tube. It is well acknowledged that our mouth contain numerous bacteria yeasts and viruses in some cases like herpes and that siphoning like this is far from 'best practice'
I fill the hose using sanitised hose, hands and dip tube. This is a simple way to siphon beer without sucking on the pipe and my recomendstion is to use this rather than touching the siphon hose with your mouth.
1. sanitise hose (in boiling water or sanitiser)
2. sanitise hands (alcohol sanitiser in my case
3 have a cold water tap trickling
4 hold one end of hose in air
5 fill the other end with the trickling water
6 as the water enters the tube lower the high end which you were holding up in the air.
7 the tube fills completly
8 the tube will autosiphon
Keep criticising lads! for everybodys benefit
this is probably the number 1 critical issue in brewing
Quote from: imark on May 11, 2013, 12:10:21 AM
I've done the 'direct syphon' method and it's fine IMO if you turn off flow and let spigot sit in starsan for a while. Not had a problem yet.
Let's get principles right. Practice follows
Teach a man to fish....
Hi Imark
arguably it is not 'best practice' and is it not cumbersome to have to wait to re sanitise the tube when really we should be half way through the transfer? we need to get lid off fermenting vessel and transfer asap. In the meantime is the fermenter top open, how long does it take for starsan and why would we re contaminate the already sanitised tube? I dont see it as 'best practice' or even 'good practice' and it certainly would not be in my homebrew handbook and or homebrew course when there is a simpler, safer and less cumbersome method of starting the siphon.
Any other comments on this point please...what way do you siphon? and how good or bad is sucking on the tube in your opinions? anyone use autosyphon or a pump?
Dont forget keep spotting the terrible flaws in the beermaking on the video :) Great kits....terrible instructions :o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=QFnYQHIlxhQ
I think the video is meant to be a quick run through rather than a complete A to Z of brewing.
If it gets people interested and making beer then that's a good thing. There's lots to learn and always room for improvement.
I syphon my wine the same way.
Give a good suck on the tube and get a mouthful of tasty wine, then spill it all over the floor while I fumble for a bottle.
Great fun altogether, and no infections.
Looks like the guy in the video got away with it too, him and his hipster friends are all having a great time boozing it up ;D
For beer I use a tap, it's just easier.
Overall John's right, the video's not bad at all. Better than the video i learned off. One of Craigtube's delightful blunderings. Magic!
Maybe the glass was straight out of the dish washer and not sitting in the dogs bowl! ::)
Of course its an advertisment for the company, its also sold in our homebrew shops lables 1,2,3, steps to "commercial quality beer quickly and easily at home" Last 20 MYOB Wheat kits @homebrew company for 7 euros :) Its not a comprehensive kit brewing lesson, if we were going to produce a Homebrew club lesson plan, coursebook and practical sessions as part of the course we need agreement on 'best practise'. Me U and everyone else can do it whatever way we like and you or me may find we are successful but maybe not. On that point I posted the sanitation / chemicals topic because we are all over the place re the best cleaning solutions and thats why I'm trying to find what is really best? starsan, peracetic acid, Hydrogen peroxide of the Lidl Oxyaction which I believe is superb but there are other superb products for cleaning & sterilising together.
For those new to brewing, they may not keep brewing if they make 80's style crap homebrew beer :) I put up the post to help especially the newbies understand some of the mistakes that ruin their beer.
Kits have come on tremendously since the 80's John Bull, Kwoffit, brewmaker and so on, however the instructions are the same old 'just grab a bucket and enjoy'
re dishwasher:
I agree the glass may have been straight from the dishwasher but his wooly jumper that was shaking / dropping dust into the beer was probably on him all day :D. For those thinking of brewing it gives the impression you can just dunk a glass and take a and probably just tip what u didnt drink back in ;D re stirring the wort...no wooly jumpers required, short sleeved shirt and wash hands and arms with plenty soapy water just like the surgeons do to wash off all those bacteria containing dead skin cells :D
keep it going, nice to see ye debating it regardless of whether u believe its good or bad advice.
Quote from: brenmurph on May 11, 2013, 09:50:00 AM
Yes we can get the flow going then dip the end in boiling water or starsan :) the fella in the video didnt!
so on this point:
I feel theres absolutly no need to suck on the siphon tube. It is well acknowledged that our mouth contain numerous bacteria yeasts and viruses in some cases like herpes and that siphoning like this is far from 'best practice'
I fill the hose using sanitised hose, hands and dip tube. This is a simple way to siphon beer without sucking on the pipe and my recomendstion is to use this rather than touching the siphon hose with your mouth.
1. sanitise hose (in boiling water or sanitiser)
2. sanitise hands (alcohol sanitiser in my case
3 have a cold water tap trickling
4 hold one end of hose in air
5 fill the other end with the trickling water
6 as the water enters the tube lower the high end which you were holding up in the air.
7 the tube fills completly
8 the tube will autosiphon
Keep criticising lads! for everybodys benefit
this is probably the number 1 critical issue in brewing
It's madness to go to all that trouble sanitising and then run tap water straight into the hose? No?
I use a spare few inches if hose over the tat that I suck on and then remove, never touching the sanitised hose
my beer is all produced with tap water which is in my case RO filtered so safe (recent forum debate on RO systems). My tap/faucet is removable and sterile by boiling, thats my OTT procedure on brew & bottle keg day. So the water to prime the siphon is safe and safer.
I agree with the extra piece of tube, thats great ive seen it before. Get the body of an old cylindrical pen or a small piece of siphon tube. ;)
quote Lars:
"It's madness to go to all that trouble sanitising and then run tap water straight into the hose? No?
I use a spare few inches if hose over the tat that I suck on and then remove, never touching the sanitised hose"
No and Yes, Lars
On the point of putting water into sanitised tube:
It certainly isnt madness :) Isnt 99% of brewing done using municipal water including commercial breweries? municipal / tap water, (which is gernerally regarded as safe) and I have to suggest that our tap water is safe however out individual taps may have some visible mould and contain other baddies so at least run boiling water over tap or spray starsan to be 100% sure of our tap. I use an extendable sprayhead which drops straight into my kettle for a minute.
So lars to clarify and emphasise what shouldnt be done, can we agree that:
1 siphon by ur method is perfect
2. using municipal water is safe
3. using earlier suggestion of suck and sanitise what your mouth touched is ok
3 but sticking ones gob on the siphon tube isnt best practice if ur goint to spill it straight into beer, that has to be bad advice in general
Sanitise the hose, use a sucking tube adapter as you suggest or use the method I use successfully either way thats what this topic is about trying to get the best method of doing the brew tasks with successful results especially for the newer brewers :)
tanks for that post!
It's definitely not best practice. But bearing in mind that the advert is for the full kit including bucket they're going to show how to brew using only that kit of equipment.
I don't have an auto syphon myself. I usually submerse the syphon in bucket of starsan to fill it. Then transfer full to bucket and open up. Drain off the first glass of starsan & beer and the rest goes to bottling or keg.
Quote from: imark on May 11, 2013, 12:41:49 PM
I don't have an auto syphon myself. I usually submerse the syphon in bucket of starsan to fill it. Then transfer full to bucket and open up. Drain off the first glass of starsan & beer and the rest goes to bottling or keg.
cant argue with that ;D good advice......................dont forget keep bucket covered may be a good idea, just enough gap to let hose in......we have to remember the air is full of bacteria / yeasts/ spores/ moulds and hatched fruit flies in summer which are barely visible....so dont leave lid off you buckets unless absolutely necessary.
an idea re bottling. using cardboard box or crates have sanitises / sterilised bottles lined up. Prepare a teatowel in advance on bottling day ( homebrew works out efficient when prepared well for your brew/ bottle day). Boil teatowel in a tiny amount of water, just enough to create steam in a closed saucepan. Boil/ steam for a minute. If you do this an hour before actual bottling time you then have a cooled, sterilised cloth. sanitise hands with alcohol sanitiser ( a staple item in my brew kitchen) and wring out your sanitised towel. I use this to keep bottles covered, most importantly in summer when as soon as you open the fermenter lid the fruit flies will suddenly appear sometimes by the dozen ;) the feckers love beer ;D. peel back towel as you fill your bottles and only expose bottles when capping.
Personally I find an asistant is very useful on bottling day!
I suggest this above as it is likely that this bottling of say 40 bottles and is time consuming so more chance of something airborne getting into the bottles. It sounds complicated but its absolutely simple and takes no time at all...just a simple prep job.
@Bren I have a private well which has choliforms which exist in many or most private wells I believe. I use my RO tap for brewing water. So I never allow my tap water near the cold side of my setup.
When bottling I sanitise using Starsan in my vinator and store inverted on bottling tree , takes <10mins for 40ish bottles. I then fill them, line them up and cap them.
All gud lars. I'm a fan of ro water for brewing.
In the video he only said to sanitise the bucket, lid and stirring paddle. I thought you'd have to sanitize the scissors as well, and the outside of the yeast packet.
Also, maybe he should use brewing sugar instead of normal sugar.
I'm only on my first brew, so I can't think of anything else.
so well spotted, all these little things help ensure a good brew!!
Hi DocC,
What part of the World are you in?
Post up in Introductions.
And welcome to the NHC!
Hi John,
Sorry for the late reply. I'm from Galway, and I'll do that now.
I just signed up for a membership card, so I figure I'll have to stop lurking so much.
Thanks!