Just brewed my first Kolsch, and I have to say it tastes remarkably like Ór! Is there something I'm missing here?
No. I think Or is brewed with US05.
Ór is a blonde ale from what I know, Koelsch would be the same, I think the handling and lagering is different.
I just brewed my first kolsch too, although I used the wrong yeast for it , WLP090 san diego super yeast so i think mine ended up a bit dry.. The kolsch's I have tasted are very clean . Mine I am happy enough with the fermentation and beer cleaned up enough but i could have gone a bit heavier with the hopping .
Which Kolsch did you have ?
It's quite possible that Ór is at the Kolsch end of Blonde and the Kolsch you tried is at the Blonde End of Kolsch !!
the two styles wouldn't be a million miles from each other apart from the Yeast being more important for flavour in the Kolsch.
Quote from: Tube on May 24, 2013, 03:12:34 PM
Had a pint of Ór on Wednesday night. Diacetyl is gone from it again and with it the sweetness that made it like my Kolsch. I'll have another pint tomorrow, for research purposes of course. :)
That inconsistency is what is not really acceptable in some of the craft brews.
A commercial product should be consistently the same to maintain the market.
The great unwashed are not as tolerant of these changes as us what understand.
The fact that it is a craft product surely means that there will be variation from batch to batch
I try not to be publically too critical about the craft brewers but I have pointed out in the past that if they do not address consistancy they will make and lose customers. The night of the Red polo shirt party people went up to the bar and chose what they wanted to drink,half of the beers drank that night were Metelman pale ale.
Metalman does beat the pants of the rest even when they have a good day though. A consistently good pint. Wish we had it in Newry. Metalman FTW!
Quote from: DEMPSEY on May 24, 2013, 10:13:02 PM
I try not to be publically too critical about the craft brewers but I have pointed out in the past that if they do not address consistancy they will make and lose customers. The night of the Red polo shirt party people went up to the bar and chose what they wanted to drink,half of the beers drank that night were Metelman pale ale.
I'm not overly critical, I will always criticise a lack of consistency though. You are I are on the same page on this one I know that from conversations had with you in the past.
Commercial is all about consistency, no point in producing a cracking product this week and a crappy one the next, the punter will remember the bad one, I'll probably forgive, knowing the technical issue that can befall a brewer, mr converted heino drinker will not be as forgiving.
I think the criticism helps and keeps people grounded :)
Quote from: Eoin on May 27, 2013, 05:40:48 PM
Quote from: DEMPSEY on May 24, 2013, 10:13:02 PM
I try not to be publically too critical about the craft brewers but I have pointed out in the past that if they do not address consistancy they will make and lose customers. The night of the Red polo shirt party people went up to the bar and chose what they wanted to drink,half of the beers drank that night were Metelman pale ale.
I'm not overly critical, I will always criticise a lack of consistency though. You are I are on the same page on this one I know that from conversations had with you in the past.
Commercial is all about consistency, no point in producing a cracking product this week and a crappy one the next, the punter will remember the bad one, I'll probably forgive, knowing the technical issue that can befall a brewer, mr converted heino drinker will not be as forgiving.
I think the criticism helps and keeps people grounded :)
I agree re bad pints but is variation in the product a bad thing provided the beer is still good?
Quote from: UpsidedownA (Andrew) on May 27, 2013, 07:47:27 PM
Quote from: Eoin on May 27, 2013, 05:40:48 PM
Quote from: DEMPSEY on May 24, 2013, 10:13:02 PM
I try not to be publically too critical about the craft brewers but I have pointed out in the past that if they do not address consistancy they will make and lose customers. The night of the Red polo shirt party people went up to the bar and chose what they wanted to drink,half of the beers drank that night were Metelman pale ale.
I'm not overly critical, I will always criticise a lack of consistency though. You are I are on the same page on this one I know that from conversations had with you in the past.
Commercial is all about consistency, no point in producing a cracking product this week and a crappy one the next, the punter will remember the bad one, I'll probably forgive, knowing the technical issue that can befall a brewer, mr converted heino drinker will not be as forgiving.
I think the criticism helps and keeps people grounded :)
I agree re bad pints but is variation in the product a bad thing provided the beer is still good?
Yes, I think it is, we can all brew a good pint as a homebrewer, to take it to the next level I think you need to brew the same pint every time from the same recipe. Small variations are allowed, but they can't be of the "ugggh" variety all too often.
Quote from: Eoin on May 28, 2013, 08:55:05 AM
Quote from: UpsidedownA (Andrew) on May 27, 2013, 07:47:27 PM
I agree re bad pints but is variation in the product a bad thing provided the beer is still good?
Yes, I think it is, we can all brew a good pint as a homebrewer, to take it to the next level I think you need to brew the same pint every time from the same recipe. Small variations are allowed, but they can't be of the "ugggh" variety all too often.
There you go talking about bad pints again ('Uggh' means the pint is bad, right?). Definitely, a good brewer shouldn't brew bad pints. I want to know what you think about consistency for consistency's sake. You seem to think brewing the same pint again and again is in and of itself a mark of an excellent brewer. I don't think it is. Beer is a natural product from natural ingredients that can be expected to vary from year to year. I see this as no bad thing. I don't expect many people are likely to compare pints from different batches anyway, but suppose you did and detected a difference. Is that really a big deal, if both pints are satisfying and enjoyable?
Two different things I think. If I drink a pint today and think, mmmm, nice, and then buy a pint of the same beer next week and think ugghhh, that's poor quality control. The pints don't have to be consistently the same, but they should be consistently of the same quality, similar flavour, body, esters, etc. A really good brewer could turn out the same pint of beer consistently regardless of seasonal variations in ingredients, but for us mere mortals, brewing at a consistent quality should be the goal. If I buy a pint of X, I should expect to get a pint of X, not Y, or possibly Z...
Quote from: UpsidedownA (Andrew) on June 01, 2013, 08:10:49 AM
Quote from: Eoin on May 28, 2013, 08:55:05 AM
Quote from: UpsidedownA (Andrew) on May 27, 2013, 07:47:27 PM
I agree re bad pints but is variation in the product a bad thing provided the beer is still good?
Yes, I think it is, we can all brew a good pint as a homebrewer, to take it to the next level I think you need to brew the same pint every time from the same recipe. Small variations are allowed, but they can't be of the "ugggh" variety all too often.
There you go talking about bad pints again ('Uggh' means the pint is bad, right?). Definitely, a good brewer shouldn't brew bad pints. I want to know what you think about consistency for consistency's sake. You seem to think brewing the same pint again and again is in and of itself a mark of an excellent brewer. I don't think it is. Beer is a natural product from natural ingredients that can be expected to vary from year to year. I see this as no bad thing. I don't expect many people are likely to compare pints from different batches anyway, but suppose you did and detected a difference. Is that really a big deal, if both pints are satisfying and enjoyable?
Yeah well I have had bad pints and I have had pints which are just different to the last time. I'm of the opinion that a product should be consistently good and consistently the same. What's the point in naming a beer if you put out a product which is different from the last time. Just put a batch number on it if you wish to be all hippy about it and just provide a "nice pint".
I think the mark of a good brewer is consistency, and I'm afraid you won't move me off of that opinion.
I can make exceptions as a homebrewer, only because I understand the technicalities, but the great unwashed are not so forgiving, that said I will remember when a pint is inconsistent and the flawed beers are all too often the case.
I recently had a batch of craft beers, of 23 bottles 4 had a notable infection...that's shit to be frank and it'd not happen in my homebrew.
I also feel some of the newer breweries went to market too soon and were "beta testing" their test batches on the public as some of them betimes were simply woeful.