I haven't brewed in over 2 years but after attending the Maiden City Brewers meet on Saturday in Derry I decided to get all my gear out and get a couple of brews going.Thing is they've just past the best before date on the can.Have a Coopers Stout and Australian Pale Ale which had a date of mid-June 2013 and a Coopers Irish Stout and Canadian Blonde which were up a couple of weeks ago.Would it be OK to go ahead with these or would I be better cutting my loses and buying some fresh kit?
Quote from: DCLavs on July 31, 2013, 03:17:08 PM
I haven't brewed in over 2 years but after attending the Maiden City Brewers meet on Saturday in Derry I decided to get all my gear out and get a couple of brews going.Thing is they've just past the best before date on the can.Have a Coopers Stout and Australian Pale Ale which had a date of mid-June 2013 and a Coopers Irish Stout and Canadian Blonde which were up a couple of weeks ago.Would it be OK to go ahead with these or would I be better cutting my loses and buying some fresh kit?
They'll be just fine. Maybe a bit darker than originally intended, but you'd be mad to chuck them out. Maybe chuck the yeast and use a sachet of good commercial yeast like US-05 or Nottingham..
They're fine. It's just a 'BEST BEFORE' date, not a 'USE BEFORE OR IT WILL KILL YOU' date.
The hop flavors might be a little less, it might be a little darker.
The yeast would be my main concern as it's alive. Maybe replace it.
Otherwise it'll still be just as good. :)
Wow Bubbles, that was fast! ;D
eye of the tiger! :D
Replace the yeast and get it brewed.
I've seen some of the tight brits brewing stuff from the 80's, the malt extract is a little darker nothing else.
Also as long as the tin is not bowed out at the sides you're grand.
Cheers all.New yeast it is then.....I guess that's my other question answered too.....have about 15 different sachets of yeast which have been sitting 2 years as well.Bin for them (or will dehydrating before pitching tell me if they're still alive?).
Any yeast recommendations.....for the stouts and the blonde/ale?
Quote from: DCLavs on July 31, 2013, 05:33:28 PMhave about 15 different sachets of yeast which have been sitting 2 years as well.Bin for them
Bin, for certain.
Quote from: DCLavs on July 31, 2013, 05:33:28 PMwill dehydrating before pitching tell me if they're still alive?
No. Attempting to make a starter
will tell you if it's still alive. But I wouldn't take the risk, personally. The yeast is just too old.
Quote from: DCLavs on July 31, 2013, 05:33:28 PM
Any yeast recommendations.....for the stouts and the blonde/ale?
Danstar Nottingham is a good all-purpose yeast, suitable for both of your beers. Clean profile, highly attenuative and flocculates well.
Glad to hear you're getting back into it.
As Bubbles says, Danstar Nottingham is good and I seem to get good results with US-05 too.
If you buy some hops you can give the kits a bit more life as well.
Aye, the yeasts might be fine, but are you willing to risk 23L of beer on it? bin them all.
Coopers Stout and Canadian Blonde- id go with fermentis S04 or danstar nottingham
Australian Pale Ale - I'd go with fermentis US05.
Dryhopping will fix anything that age has taken from each kit :)
Quote from: irish_goat on July 31, 2013, 06:38:26 PMIf you buy some hops you can give the kits a bit more life as well.
+1 to that.
Do a hop tea or dry-hop the APA and Canadian Blonde kits for some extra flavour and aroma. The APA kit is a real good 'un. I did it several times myself and makes a great base for an American Pale Ale with the addition of extra hops.
Eoin, ya beat me to it that time! :)
eagle eyes!
You can use out of date yeast as yeast nutrient. Not sure how with a kit, but with extract or all grain you'd just throw in toward the end of the boil.
I've heard that alright. Something to do with the contents of the yeast sachet being a mix of yeast and nutrient.
Suppose you could just put it in a cup of boiling water and dump it into the FV.
Danstar Nottingham...3 of the sachets are that...just checked and all are out of date.Must get some fresh yeast and hops.Take it from there then.Thanks again all.
If you don't have old yeast sachets then reach for the Marmite!
Check where its made: "Burton-on-Trent"!
Guess what B-o-T is famous for: Beer!!
What is a by product of beer making: Autolysed Yeast!
So thats it !
A pinch of Marmite equals skillions of sterilsed, boiled up, pressure cooked yest cells containg all the nutrients that our fresh little offspring are looking for!
When ever someone has said "Oh thats a difficult yeast to cultutre: I just add a pinch (like tip off knife blade to 250 mL of sterile wort) and never had a problem.
On the question of dry hopping....could you recommend which hops would be best for the stouts and which for the ale and the blonde?
Gonna try and get these all going at once.
Does the hops get added at the start or near the end?
When it comes to adding hops to a kit you have a few options.
You can make a hop tea i.e. add hops to boiling water, leave to sit for 15 mins and then add the liquid when you're making the kit. A coffee cafetière works well here but you can use a pot and a colander as well.
Or you can simply throw dry hops in, either at the start or after (or even during fermentation).
As for varieties I would recommend starting off with a classic like cascade. It works well in IPAs but you can also add it to stouts and porters. I've plenty up here in the house if you want some, will be in the social club tomorrow too if you want to chat.
Those hop teas are great. Simple and effective.
Throwing them in loose works fine, but can get messy. pellets will break up, float, then sink into the trub. leaf will do the same but are more prone to clogging the tap or syphon. you can avoid it with leaf easy enough by using a muslin bag (boiled to sterilize) weighed down with a few sterile marbles. with pellets i don't usually bother.
I like fuggles or east kent goldings for stout, cascade/amarillo for pale ale, anything at all for the blonde. Bramling cross is another favorite. I've heard great things about mateuka and willamette but not tried them yet.
This page is great, letting you choose a style and listing popular hops:
http://byo.com/resources/hops (http://byo.com/resources/hops)
Quote from: LordEoin on July 31, 2013, 10:50:03 PM
Something to do with the contents of the yeast sachet being a mix of yeast and nutrient.
From what I understand it's simply that old yeast cells will provide the building blocks, being made of the same thing, for new yeast cells.
I think the nutrient might help, but it's not key to the affair.
While I wouldn't disagree with any of the science imparted in this thread, if I was the OP I wouldn't bother chucking a packet of dead, 2 year old yeast into my nice beer. A fresh sachet of yeast will give you everything you need to ferment your beer cleanly. Best place for those old sachets is the bin.
Quote from: Bubbles on August 02, 2013, 10:02:03 AM
While I wouldn't disagree with any of the science imparted in this thread, if I was the OP I wouldn't bother chucking a packet of dead, 2 year old yeast into my nice beer. A fresh sachet of yeast will give you everything you need to ferment your beer cleanly. Best place for those old sachets is the bin.
Old yeast is a perfectly good yeast nutrient and should go into the boil, it's not suitable in a kit beer, so realistically it's not suitable in a kit beer unless you do a boil.
If you look at servomyces which is produced by White labs, it is old yeast hulls being sold as a yeast nutrient.
http://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/white-labs-nutrient-wln10001-p-1248.html
and it works very well
Quote from: Eoin on August 02, 2013, 12:31:54 PM
Old yeast is a perfectly good yeast nutrient and should go into the boil, it's not suitable in a kit beer, so realistically it's not suitable in a kit beer unless you do a boil.
Would adding it to the bucket when you're adding the boiling water and DME do the job? That should sufficiently kill it no? If not it'd be easy enough to do a small boil with the DME and add it then I suppose. Good excuse to do a boil so you can add extra hops or steeped grains then as well.
Quote from: irish_goat on August 02, 2013, 01:34:07 PM
Quote from: Eoin on August 02, 2013, 12:31:54 PM
Old yeast is a perfectly good yeast nutrient and should go into the boil, it's not suitable in a kit beer, so realistically it's not suitable in a kit beer unless you do a boil.
Would adding it to the bucket when you're adding the boiling water and DME do the job? That should sufficiently kill it no? If not it'd be easy enough to do a small boil with the DME and add it then I suppose. Good excuse to do a boil so you can add extra hops or steeped grains then as well.
I suppose to take a small bit of your overall liquor and add the old yeast to that and do a boil would be sufficient to make sure that the yeast was completely dead, would work.