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General Discussions => Brewing Communities => Rebel Brewers => Topic started by: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 06:17:25 PM

Title: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 06:17:25 PM
I was just in the No.21 Off Licence near Bridge Street in Cork. The guy in there was saying he is thinking of buying in growlers and getting kegs of craft beer and letting people come in and fill up their growlers. I think it's a great idea, hope he does it.

I was also able to find these elusive Julian Cooper Beers. Label says he is brewing on Camden Quay in Cork. Has anyone figured out who this is?
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 16, 2013, 06:41:19 PM
Quote from: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 06:17:25 PM
I was just in the No.21 Off Licence near Bridge Street in Cork. The guy in there was saying he is thinking of buying in growlers and getting kegs of craft beer and letting people come in and fill up their growlers. I think it's a great idea, hope he does it.

I was also able to find these elusive Julian Cooper Beers. Label says he is brewing on Camden Quay in Cork. Has anyone figured out who this is?

https://twitter.com/JulianCoopers
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Taf on August 16, 2013, 07:06:01 PM
Have heard conflicting stories in relation to whether he has all the required paperwork to sell his beer, but presume he must be, if an offy and pub are selling it.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 16, 2013, 07:15:28 PM
Quote from: Taf on August 16, 2013, 07:06:01 PM
Have heard conflicting stories in relation to whether he has all the required paperwork to sell his beer, but presume he must be, if an offy and pub are selling it.

you can never tell with them dodgy Cork boyos  :P
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 07:24:24 PM
Quote from: Taf on August 16, 2013, 07:06:01 PM
Have heard conflicting stories in relation to whether he has all the required paperwork to sell his beer, but presume he must be, if an offy and pub are selling it.
I've heard conflicting reports, too. All I can see is he does not appear on Revenue's list of current valid liquor licences  ??? (unless he is operating under another name).... but if a brewer approached an off licence looking to sell beer, I doubt the offy manager would ask to see his manufacturing licence. Probably just assumed it's all sorted.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 16, 2013, 07:38:14 PM
Would he not have to have a registered VAT number?
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 08:06:21 PM
Quote from: deadman1972 on August 16, 2013, 07:38:14 PM
Would he not have to have a registered VAT number?
No, I don't think so. Suppliers of goods don't have to register for VAT unless their projected turnover is over 75k per year.  But for beer manufacturing Excise is the issue, and brewers have to pay 500 euro for the manufacture's licence, and work out the excise bond with Revenue.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 16, 2013, 08:13:44 PM
usually when information is not readily available in this kind of situation i ask myself "who is hiding what" and "why" ? Might be perfectly innocent but in fairness if the offies don't know what they are selling that's a red flag to me sorry :(
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 09:04:01 PM
Quote from: deadman1972 on August 16, 2013, 08:13:44 PM
usually when information is not readily available in this kind of situation i ask myself "who is hiding what" and "why" ? Might be perfectly innocent but in fairness if the offies don't know what they are selling that's a red flag to me sorry :(
Well the label does say it was made in a "home brewery" ... and having cracked open the bottle of Summer Blonde it does, in my opinion, taste like homebrew. Lots of DMS...

Edit: just gleaned this off of a Beoir thread on Julian Coopers... "It is an illegal homebrew, sold without paying taxes and excises. I'm a prolific homebrewer in camden quay as well and people are assuming I'm the brewer. That pissed me off. Because the last thing I want to see it the custom and excise people showing up at my place asking me to prove I'm not the one brewing this. Akavango"  ??? hmmm...
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 16, 2013, 09:32:01 PM
Quote from: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 09:04:01 PM
Quote from: deadman1972 on August 16, 2013, 08:13:44 PM
usually when information is not readily available in this kind of situation i ask myself "who is hiding what" and "why" ? Might be perfectly innocent but in fairness if the offies don't know what they are selling that's a red flag to me sorry :(
Well the label does say it was made in a "home brewery" ... and having cracked open the bottle of Summer Blonde it does, in my opinion, taste like homebrew. Lots of DMS...

Edit: just gleaned this off of a Beoir thread on Julian Coopers... "It is an illegal homebrew, sold without paying taxes and excises. I'm a prolific homebrewer in camden quay as well and people are assuming I'm the brewer. That pissed me off. Because the last thing I want to see it the custom and excise people showing up at my place asking me to prove I'm not the one brewing this. Akavango"  ??? hmmm...

LOL ya i also saw that on Beoir but i am not sure as to its voracity?  ;D
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: jus223 on August 16, 2013, 10:47:41 PM
I just cracked open a bottle of his party ale. It tastes pretty awful. Ive thrown better beer down the sink
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 10:49:34 PM
Yeah, who knows exactly what is going on there.... we are down here in the Rebel county afterall...  but I can say both beers ended up down the drain. Really bad off flavours and bad aroma (DMS in one, Metallic in another). I can honestly say that I brew better beer, and so does Jus223, and so does Taf.

And that offy is selling it there for 3 euro a bottle, and presumably that's mostly profit as there are (allegedly) no taxes being paid (?) hmmm
Gives craft beer a bad name, IMHO
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: johnrm on August 16, 2013, 11:23:47 PM
If its that bad, go back to the Offy with the empty and ask for your money back.
Tell them they're not selling goods fit for a purpose.
If need be, get them to crack open a bottle and taste it.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 16, 2013, 11:32:47 PM
Quote from: johnrm on August 16, 2013, 11:23:47 PM
If its that bad, go back to the Offy with the empty and ask for your money back.
Tell them they're not selling goods fit for a purpose.
If need be, get them to crack open a bottle and taste it.

+1 that, just to see what way they react would be worth it, tell them you would like to know what brewery brewed them and see what they say.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: LordEoin on August 17, 2013, 01:40:11 AM
Really? but i spent all night juicing cats and milking driptrays in my camden quay laboratory making the stuff! and that's how you rate it? It took me over 2 days of fermenting at body temperature. Do you know how difficult it is to keep an bucket of catjuice and slops pressed against your crotch for over 2 days? DO YOU??

but seriously though, you've made me want to go out and buy one out of curiosity  ;D

Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Taf on August 17, 2013, 06:28:28 AM
I might just ask him to clarify on twitter.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Garry on August 17, 2013, 08:42:00 PM
He'd make an interesting interviewee for the brewer's spotlight series if he could be tracked down?
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Taf on August 19, 2013, 12:38:01 PM
Just asked him about his legal status via twitter.

https://twitter.com/BeerBilly
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: irish_goat on August 19, 2013, 01:28:23 PM
He uses 500ml bottles and according to the Beoir thread, delivers them in a Tesco shopping bag. Besides that I would say it's very unlikely he is anywhere near the scale of 8 Degrees.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 19, 2013, 02:29:27 PM
Quote from: irish_goat on August 19, 2013, 01:28:23 PM
He uses 500ml bottles and according to the Beoir thread, delivers them in a Tesco shopping bag. Besides that I would say it's very unlikely he is anywhere near the scale of 8 Degrees.

If he is delivering them in a Tesco shopping bag that tells me all i need to know tbh :D
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Bubbles on August 19, 2013, 02:40:58 PM
Quote from: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 09:04:01 PMEdit: just gleaned this off of a Beoir thread on Julian Coopers... "It is an illegal homebrew, sold without paying taxes and excises. I'm a prolific homebrewer in camden quay as well and people are assuming I'm the brewer. That pissed me off. Because the last thing I want to see it the custom and excise people showing up at my place asking me to prove I'm not the one brewing this. Akavango"  ??? hmmm...

??? ??? ???
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Taf on August 19, 2013, 02:43:34 PM
Quote from: Il Tubo on August 19, 2013, 01:21:30 PM

It's unlikely he's brewing it and selling it without being registered with the Revenue and the HSE.


I'd like to think that as well, but a lot of people are talking about it in Cork now, so it would be good to get clarification. Some people are not too happy, as if he is not legit, they think it will give negative attention to law abiding homebrewers. If he is legit, let that be communicated so that he is not being wronged when he doesn't deserve it.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 19, 2013, 02:46:03 PM
Quote from: Taf on August 19, 2013, 02:43:34 PM
Quote from: Il Tubo on August 19, 2013, 01:21:30 PM

It's unlikely he's brewing it and selling it without being registered with the Revenue and the HSE.


I'd like to think that as well, but a lot of people are talking about it in Cork now, so it would be good to get clarification. Some people are not too happy, as if he is not legit, they think it will give negative attention to law abiding homebrewers. If he is legit, let that be communicated so that he is not being wronged when he doesn't deserve it.

Exactly why i would like to know as home brewers get the hairy eyeball in certain quarters as is,plus i am a nosey bastard :o
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: BrewCity on August 19, 2013, 03:18:31 PM
Quote from: Il Tubo on August 19, 2013, 01:21:30 PM
Here are the licensed manufacturers in Cork.

University College Cork              College Road, Cork
Heineken Ireland Ltd                 Leitrim Street, Cork
Eight Degrees Brewing Co Ltd         Unit 3 Mitchelstown Advance Factory, Coolnanave, Mitchelstown, Co. Cork
Kinsale Craft Brewery Ltd            Kinsale Craft Brewery, Knocknabohilly, Kinsale, Co. Cork
Docklands Brewing Company Ltd        Franciscan Well Brewery, 14 North Mall, Cork


It's unlikely he's brewing it and selling it without being registered with the Revenue and the HSE.

MY money is on one of the above producing it, probably the 3rd one.

Definitely not at 8 degrees as they don't bottle in 500ml sizes. And we know it's not Kinsale or the Well or Heineken. UCC is not impossible, but it definitely tastes like homebrew, if you know what I mean, not a professional brew.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Taf on August 19, 2013, 03:21:59 PM
Just went through the Twitter feed of the off license that is being supplied, and it states only 20 bottles of this batch, so I can't see how he is legit with such small batches. If you dig deeper, you can also see the actual person on facebook.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 19, 2013, 03:22:51 PM
Guys can somebody from Cork not just go into whatever oofie or boozer is selling this stuff and just ask them point blank who makes it? ;)
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Will_D on August 19, 2013, 04:46:37 PM
If they are a bit reluctant ("we couldn't possible reveal our sorces" crap) then just point out that they are also conspiring to defraud the revenue and would loose their "off-license" plus probably and/or suffer  massive revenue/excise/vat audit!

I agree with the concerns of others that if this goes public then us HBers will be suspected of all sorts of nefarious wrong doings!
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Will_D on August 19, 2013, 04:50:50 PM
I would also like a mod to edit out these off-topic bits about yer man and put them in the members only area!

Any body can read this thread!
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: LordEoin on August 19, 2013, 04:54:50 PM
Quote from: Will_D on August 19, 2013, 04:50:50 PM
I would also like a mod to edit out these off-topic bits about yer man and put them in the members only area!

Any body can read this thread!
Just blank out any bits that aren't pulled from public sources, but I don't think there are any.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Greg2013 on August 19, 2013, 05:12:08 PM
Quote from: Will_D on August 19, 2013, 04:50:50 PM
I would also like a mod to edit out these off-topic bits about yer man and put them in the members only area!

Any body can read this thread!

I see where you are coming from but I don't think hiding it in the members only section is the way to go IMHO. I do not see anything to worry about so far IMHO and tbh we need everybody possible to see this if it's something that COULD affect us all.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Garry on August 19, 2013, 05:26:30 PM
I don't see how it's off topic, the original post reads:

Quote from: BrewCity on August 16, 2013, 06:17:25 PM
I was also able to find these elusive Julian Cooper Beers. Label says he is brewing on Camden Quay in Cork. Has anyone figured out who this is?

No one has written anything about "Julian Cooper" here that can't be found on google. Don't you think that suggesting to hide this in the members area is implying that we are all up to "nefarious wrong doings"?
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: LordEoin on August 19, 2013, 05:34:26 PM
The best thing would probably be to just ask the manager in the Gateway or No21,  or tweet @No21Cork , @TheGatewayBar  or #No21BeerClub or just ask him directly.
I've sent him a bookface request via facebook (http://facebook.com) , Taf's tweeted him on twitter (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=julian+cooper+beer+twitter)
All is good, stay calm and carry on.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Ciderhead on August 19, 2013, 06:07:12 PM
I thought you were all rebels down there, I didn't realise that you were all so conscientious in your payment of taxes ;)
Mind you, commercially sh1t homebrewed beer deserves to be outed  :)
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Ciderhead on August 19, 2013, 08:39:46 PM
Quote from: Il Tubo on August 19, 2013, 08:33:30 PM


Anything of a more personal nature would be against the rules.

Thanks!

Please explain to an idiot that doesn't actively use his twitter account why this is the case is there a legal exposure here?

How does that impact bloggers on here that have twitter links in their sigs?

Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: johnrm on August 19, 2013, 08:44:24 PM
At a users request I have edited out the 'Personal' detail from Reply#33.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: LordEoin on August 19, 2013, 09:11:29 PM
If you looked at the links that were in post #33 you'd see that they were both 'Social Networking accounts that are being used to promote business'
No different to linking facebook.com/kinsalebrewery (http://facebook.com/kinsalebrewery) and twitter.com/kinsalebrewery (http://twitter.com/kinsalebrewery) (both fantastic pages for a fantastic brewery)
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: johnrm on August 19, 2013, 10:01:54 PM
A Moderation Report has been opened by a new (today) user stating 'Personal detail' is disclosed in the thread.

I removed what I believe to be the links and advised that this is being done for now.
I also advised that these links are in the public domain and can be found by anybody so inclined.
Additionally I asked that the request be substantiated.

I have reviewed the request and the links seem to be to a person/business who openly sells legitimate alcoholic beverages in which case I fail to see where the issue is.

Links reinstated.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: mr hoppy on August 20, 2013, 01:26:46 AM
So what about those growlers then?
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: LordEoin on August 20, 2013, 01:57:56 AM
He seems to have closed his facebook account now.
If he wanted the links removed he shouldhave just PMd me and asked.
They are now modified to generic links.

So yeah, good man Mr Happy, growlers!
Where else fills them? I heard rumours of the bierhaus filling growlers. Anyone know for sure?
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Ciderhead on August 20, 2013, 08:04:58 AM
Yep they do and can also sell you a mug with your name on!
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: BrewCity on August 20, 2013, 09:02:14 AM
Quote from: Ciderhead on August 20, 2013, 08:04:58 AM
Yep they do and can also sell you a mug with your name on!

I've heard the Bierhaus do growlers, but I've never actually seen anyone get one. I'm not brave enough to walk in with my giant "moonshine" jug and ask someone to fill it with beer... probably get funny looks.

Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Taf on August 20, 2013, 09:28:33 AM
I know that one of the lads in the past used to get litre bottles filled at the F Well for takeaway. I don't know if there is an official policy though, and maybe more to do with the fact that he was a serious customer. I will ask them next time I am in.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: johnrm on August 20, 2013, 09:50:34 AM
I'm Assuming these are filled from the tap with no special filler.
If so, then these are for consumption shortly after filling.
Am I right?
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Garry on August 20, 2013, 09:53:47 AM
Quote from: johnrm on August 20, 2013, 09:50:34 AM
I'm Assuming these are filled from the tap with no special filler.
If so, then these are for consumption shortly after filling.
Am I right?

I would assume the same. You take it home and drink it that night.

How do they stop the bottle/growler filling with foam when they are filling it from the tap?
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Taf on August 20, 2013, 09:54:35 AM
Quote from: johnrm on August 20, 2013, 09:50:34 AM
I'm Assuming these are filled from the tap with no special filler.
If so, then these are for consumption shortly after filling.
Am I right?

Yes, I would think you are right. They won't last long unless they have a specific setup for growlers. I think that the Fella in the Well, if he wanted to take some beer on holiday with him, used to add a small bit of sugar into the bottle to kick off bottle fermentation, so that it would have some life in it.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Taf on August 20, 2013, 09:56:43 AM
Quote from: Garry on August 20, 2013, 09:53:47 AM
How do they stop the bottle/growler filling with foam when they are filling it from the tap?

Sometimes they would put tubing onto the tap, so that the beer is going directly to the bottom of the bottle, but it still foamed when I tried this before. I think proper growler setups would flush the bottle with C02 and have some sort of beer gun in use.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: Hop Bomb on August 20, 2013, 10:30:47 AM
These are the growlers that you can inject c02 in the cap of once filled.  http://thezythosproject.com/brauler/
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: derfel on August 20, 2013, 12:14:50 PM
I've been asking around about growler fills.
Franciscan Well don't, but they're looking into it.
Porterhouse fill them.
Bierhaus fill them.
Mad Monk in Midleton are looking into it too.

I haven't had a chance to get into the Porterhouse or Bierhaus to see how they fill them, or to see what the prices are.
From my reading you can attach a filler to the standard tap in the pub to fill from the bottom.
This will reduce the foam problem.

I've seen some very fancy options in the US and UK where they have a machine to fill growlers.
You land in with your cleaned growler and the machine purges it with CO2 and fills it.
Title: Re: Growler Fills in Cork
Post by: BrewCity on August 20, 2013, 12:54:56 PM
When I got a growler in the states they put a screw cap on it and heat sealed that with a little plastic ring (probably more for legal reasons - driving with open containers and all that) but she said I'd have to drink it in the next 1-2 days.