What would be the difference between making a starter with DME and making it with glucose?
Yeast need nutrients to reproduce, glucose doesn't contain them but malt does.
Also yeast growing up in a glucose rich environment may not be capable of properly digesting maltose. They will only produce enzymes for digesting simple sugars so when you pitch into your wort the yeast will be impaired and can give off flavours.
Got this on another website.
QuoteAs an analogy, consider how unhealthy you and your decendents would be if
you were asked to live (and reproduce!) on a diet of nothing but
soda pop.
Once this bag of DME is gone Im gona stick a mash on especially for starter wort. Gona can it all & sterilize in the pressure cooker. DME is so expensive & the GB grain is so cheap. 1kg DME is 7.95e & 1KG of GB malt was 1.00e. Crazy difference.
I had some wort but it went mouldy! I made a glucose soultion and started a yeast yesterday but there aint much happening. Oh well, I thought it was worth a try! Down the drain with it.
I've saved wort for bottling and starters before but keeping it for much more than a week or so seems to be a problem.
Maybe boiling it down to a rich syrup would help it keep?
worth a read on this stuff and other related yeast info
http://www.maltosefalcons.com/tech/yeast-propagation-and-maintenance-principles-and-practices
I sometimes make all grain starters, I just do a 2L BIAB and put it in the oven for the mash. When I'm doing a lot of starters when stepping it up from a slant all the way up to 2L I use the LME from the health food shops if I don't have DME.
Quote from: christhebrewer on August 22, 2013, 01:00:18 PM
I had some wort but it went mouldy! I made a glucose soultion and started a yeast yesterday but there aint much happening. Oh well, I thought it was worth a try! Down the drain with it.
I've saved wort for bottling and starters before but keeping it for much more than a week or so seems to be a problem.
Maybe boiling it down to a rich syrup would help it keep?
It should keep fine if you sterlise it, put it in sterile jam jars and keep it in the fridge. Essentially you're talking about making your own LME so there's no reason why it can't work.
I might just try a wee BIAB. Good idea!
If you have a pressure cooker, this guy has a pretty good video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqaL1oCUYXE) on sterilising wort.
Freeze any wort you wish to make up in advance.
It's standard in Germany to prime beers with held back wort, they make it, put the main ferment on and then freeze the percentage necessary to get the correct carbonation and add it afterwards. I primed like that once, no difference to making a starter really.
nice one
Hmmm.....freeze..........ah!
Would you boil the frozen wort again before adding it? What do you freeze it in? plastic bottles?
Quote from: imark on August 23, 2013, 09:17:40 AM
Would you boil the frozen wort again before adding it? What do you freeze it in? plastic bottles?
I'd freeze it in anything, I suppose a boil would do no harm. When I did it I didn't use a frozen wort, but a mini mash I did extra.
Just while we're thinking about starters....... Why do we stir our starters? I have assumed it is to give the yeast plenty of oxygen to get max population increase. If this is so, can I just give it a good dose from my shiny new oxygen set up and forget about the stir plate? This would suit me for making bigger starters cos the demijon won't work on the stir plate.
Basically You want enough cells of yeast to make your beer so you stir it constantly in a aerobic state to get the yeasty's to make babies and not alcohol. After that you have enough baby yeast cells made you then pitch it in to the wort and it now is in anaerobic state which means it makes alcohol. :).
@iMark, pour your wort into a plastic bag, put the bag in a lunch box and freeze. Once frozen you have a stackable Nick of wort!
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I regularly freeze 2 and 3 Lt milk bottles and defrost or microwave.
Let your wort cool down to 60 or below (Hand hot) and pour it in and freeze
Quote from: christhebrewer on August 23, 2013, 05:07:33 PM
Just while we're thinking about starters....... Why do we stir our starters? I have assumed it is to give the yeast plenty of oxygen to get max population increase. If this is so, can I just give it a good dose from my shiny new oxygen set up and forget about the stir plate? This would suit me for making bigger starters cos the demijon won't work on the stir plate.
Theres a table/graph I think in the yeast book(in work now so cant look at it), it has growth rates Vs propagation methods for starters, using different agitation/oxygenation methods and the stir plate by far exceeds the yield of any of the other methods. Its not just about oxygenation but it also keeps the yeast in suspension and prevents it from settling out
I'll keep stirin' it so.
Did my first BIAB mini mash yesterday and it seems to have worked out fine. It's amazing what you get from 1kg of pale malt!
The only thing I hadn't forseen is the large ammount of break material left in the wort. Of course it hasn't been filtered through hop leaves. Is this a consideration in making the starter? Should I be trying to separate it or just stir it all in and carry on?
Does the yeast actually care?
If it's break and settles out, I'd pour it off.
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That's my reaction too but that's more hassle.
You have to wait for the break to settle, so you cant make a wort and get started the same day
You loose a lot of wort if you want it to be clear
Does it actually do any harm?
Quote from: christhebrewer on August 25, 2013, 09:57:07 AM
That's my reaction too but that's more hassle.
You have to wait for the break to settle, so you cant make a wort and get started the same day
You loose a lot of wort if you want it to be clear
Does it actually do any harm?
If it's only starter sized it's irrelevant really I suppose. The argument against BIAB says that it precipitates a lot of polyphenols which take away from the shelf life of the beer. For this reason I'd skim my boil and add gypsum and strive for as much clarity as possible normally.
No chill guys leave their beer on the trub for ages. I suppose it makes little difference.
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