Hi all,
I've made a few extracts with good success before but my last one is contaminated I think. It's a blonde ale and just tastes bitter. I use swing top bottled with a carbon drop in each. I used to put them in the dishwasher to sterilise them which worked fine but my dishwasher is broken! The last batch I just gave the bottles a rinse and took the chance but it obviously didn't work. How do you guys sterilise the bottles?
Thanks
Paul
Are you a beginner or experienced brewer ? If you are familiar with Starsan you could use that once the bottles are clean.
http://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/star-san-sanitiser-8-oz-p-1426.html
Thanks Greg, I'll have to get some of that. I was put off because I just didn't want to be drinking it along with the beer! You just make up a bucket of it and dunk your empty bottles in it?
20l water + 30ml thin bleach + 30ml spirit vinegar.
30 soconds contact time to clean glass, sterile enough to perform brain surgery.
(please dont perform brain surgery with broken glass, it's not safe)
Thank Eoin,
Is thin bleach something like Milton?
Get one of these pk and a bottling tree. http://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/bottle-rinser-steriliser-red-p-580.html
You can the use Starsan or Eoins diy stuff but you only need about 300ml of it as opposed to a bucket and it takes a fraction if the time. I sanitise 40 bottles in about 5 mins with this setup
That's perfect Lars. I'll do some shopping later. Probably get that and the red ale and the stout extract kits.
Paul
PK tbh i am currently using Eoins mix above with Milton as the bleach and make up 20 litres each time and just chuck it afterwards as its so cheap. I am not a fan of retaining any disinfectant solution once used although i did start out with starsan and it is good, just not the ONLY steriliser out there ;D
You should use 'thin' bleach for that mx. It got no added scent or any other crap and is really cheap. I assume Milton's a thin bleach or it'd leave residue on baby's bottles.
The beauty of Starsan is that you can reuse and if made with RO/DI water it lasts indefinitely. I have a spray bottle of it lying around all the time that's really handy for sanitising work area etc. you shouldn't do that with the other stuff, needs to be made fresh. A bottle of Starsan will last for years(the way I use it)
Milton is not that expensive tbh imho, if its good enough for babies bottles its good enough for brewing. I believe the vinegar(acetic acid) is added to lower the ph which makes the whole solution a better sterilizer.
I found that Milton left an after-taste
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I used to use tesco own brand thin bleach. Think it was about €1 for a big bottle. Never any flavour issues 'that I could detect'. The correct quantities are 5 US gallons to 1fluid Oz of each. I used to make smaller quantities my using a syringe
Just a reminder to not mix bleach and vinegar directly. Add them to the water. If you mix them on their own they will create chlorine gas which can be fatal, and is also invisible and may not have much smell. That's not to say that any other chemical sterilizers are any safer, read the instructions very carefully and then follow them. If you are using water/vinegar/bleach then pay close attention to getting them in the right proportions, as Lars has mentioned above.
As for Starsan, you don't need to worry about drinking it with your beer, it will break down into something tasty for your yeast. It looks expensive, but since you can reuse it it works out really cheap. I bought a large bottle of it. A year and a half later there is still about half left.
Just to be clear about terminology:
Sanitize: means to Inhibit yeast and bacteria by mild chemical (Starsan/Chlorine) or thermal processes like dish washer (less than 90C)
Sterilize: means kill the F**kers at 130C plus/Microwave Radiation/Gamma Rays
Why would you have to go up to 130 celsius to kill bacteria ? ???
I thought it was 170C in the oven.
Sterilising is not just about bacteria! What about viruses, fungii, and the other nastys.
Now wether we NEED to sterilise our things is another matter but most yeast slanters do sterilise their equipment/ingredients
Quote from: Will_D on October 28, 2013, 09:58:08 AM
Sterilising is not just about bacteria! What about viruses, fungii, and the other nastys.
Now wether we NEED to sterilise our things is another matter but most yeast slanters do sterilise their equipment/ingredients
If you have it sterilized against viruses then you have it sterilized against the rest IMHO. TBH we are not dealing with Ebola virus or MRSA here, if your brewing area has anything that nasty you should not be brewing there at all. Also remember this fact not too many people pay attention to, sterilize against everything and you will have immunity against nothing ;)
Lads, let's not go through this all over again. Were only brewing let not get carried away. There are loads of options out there cheap and expensive all do the same job, keeping your brew tasty. Its generally accepted that Lidl W5(non perfumed) is the cheapest and effective cleaner/Sanitizer. I rinse out with cold water and have never ha a problem.
http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.com/forum/index.php/topic,3392.msg41600.html#msg41600
+1 on the W5 it is my weapon of choice.
Looking to find it in bulk, did so but its more exspensive for a 25 kg bag as buying it in Lidl!
This is what they say on the Sodium Percarbonate suppliers website:
What is Sodium Percarbonate?
In the UK Sodium percarbonate, also known as Sodium Carbonate Peroxyhydrate, or oxygen bleach powder is a free-flowing, white powder. It is an addition compound of sodium carbonate and hydrogen peroxide. Percarbonate has an active available oxygen content (13%) which is equivalent to 27.5% Hydrogen peroxide. It breaks down to oxygen, water and sodium carbonate upon decomposition. It is an environmentally safe bleaching agent. Sodium Percarbonate / oxygen bleach offers many of the same functional benefits as liquid hydrogen peroxide. It dissolves into water rapidly to release oxygen and provides powerful cleaning, bleaching, stain removal and deodorizing capabilities in addition to being highly effective at killing bacteria, fungus, viruses and algae. It has the added advantage of having no odour and being non toxic, and non polluting.
Uses for Sodium Percarbonate / Oxygen Bleach
Sodium percarbonate improves the performance of conventional detergents and shampoos on stubborn stains. It is a gentle stain remover for synthetic carpeting and upholstery fabrics. It saves time by allowing cleaning in one pass that would perhaps have taken two or three passes with a carpet cleaner that uses shampoo only. It improves personal safety by eliminating the need to use harsher cleaning or stain removal products. It also eliminates the need for expensive prespotters and stain removers. It prolongs carpet cleaner machine life by reducing the use of harsh and corrosive products. It is very effective as a laundry presoak for heavily stained articles. It is colour safe. It brightens colours and prevents fabric from become yellowed or darkened.
Sodium percarbonate is effective as a disinfectant on both bacteria and viruses.
On wood it is effective in removing mildew stains and weathering. The sodium carbonate acts as a built-in detergent, removing dirt and other deposits. Thus, sodium percarbonate-based cleaners are effective in removing dirt, mildew and weathered grey residues. Once treated the wood returns to its natural original appearance. Oxygen bleach is excellent for cleaning and removing organic stains (such as coffee, tea, wine, fruit juices, foods, sauces, grass, pet stains and blood) from fabrics, plastics, fiberglass, porcelain, ceramics, wood, carpets, asphalt, concrete, etc. Oxygen bleach containing products can be used in any place in or around the house that need to be destained and deodorized; they are efficient, safe and economical.
Benefits:
No environmental hazards - breaks down to oxygen, water and sodium carbonate (soda ash) in your wash water.
Effectively kills wide range of bacteria, mould, algae, viruses, fungi
Colour safe and fabric safe. It brightens colours and prevents fabrics from becoming yellowed or darkened
Effective stain removal on a multitude of surfaces
In the laundry Sodium Percarbonate is used to destain, deodorize, and whiten. It is very effective as a laundry presoak for heavily stained articles.
Where to use:
Laundry cleaner & bleach
Spot cleaning fabrics
Carpet & Upholstery cleaning and prespotting
Kitchen surfaces and utensils
Destaining cups, Coffee Pots etc
Fridges & freezers
Chopping Boards
Bathroom surfaces
Mildew Removal tiles, grouting and walls
Wood Decks and wooden garden furniture
Plastic garden furniture
Kills algae and moss on driveways, patios, brickwork and roofs.
General household Cleaning
Removes mildew from tents and other camping equipment
Sterilizing bottles and equipment for wine and beer making
Sterilizing utensils in hairdressers and barbers
And the don't even mention brewing!!
Quote from: Will_D on October 28, 2013, 01:31:51 PM
+1 on the W5 it is my weapon of choice.
Can you share a link to the product so I know how to recognise it in store?
http://www.google.ie/imgres?imgurl=http://www.lidl.ie/static_content/lidl_ie/images/IE/IE_72934wk1513NI_01_b.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.lidl.ie/cps/rde/xchg/SID-48604C7D-247E1B8D/lidl_ni_ie/hs.xsl/4179_29380.htm&h=374&w=287&sz=83&tbnid=_jAjOlwk3ZdduM:&tbnh=90&tbnw=69&zoom=1&usg=__K6RAmxByOmkqFTtawNxVg5U8HQM=&docid=STHZ7ZHZX2pfbM&sa=X&ei=QXpuUqSCLcKthQfTp4DIBA&ved=0CFMQ9QEwBQ
It will be in the section for washing powder.
Great. Thanks.
Just on the w5 stuff from lidl. I'm confused.
A stain remover to clean bottles? How do you use it?
Paul
Add bottles to Bath of warm water, add powder, leave to soak, get bottle brush, clean and rinse.
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Quote from: pk on October 29, 2013, 04:53:42 PM
Just on the w5 stuff from lidl. I'm confused.
A stain remover to clean bottles? How do you use it?
Paul
See reply 19 - its the active atomic oxygen that is the sanitizer, the sodium carbonate is a mildly caustic crud remover.
Active oxygen kills bacteria and also bleaches a lot of dyes and stains
Simples
Quote from: Eoin on October 31, 2013, 11:19:21 AM
Add bottles to Bath of warm water, add powder, leave to soak, get bottle brush, clean and rinse.
TT
Active oxygen in this stuff will fuck your skin from right up. Picture your nuckles after a bout of bare knuckle boxing and you will get an idea of what prolonged exposure does to the skin. Wear good quality household rubber gloves to b protect your hands and wash and spillage that comes in contact with your skin with cold water.
Shanna
thanks all, I just got a delivery of extract stout and red ale with a bottle washer, bottle tree and starsan so this time I'll be using those and trying out batch priming instead of the carb drops.
One more question on the Starsan. Do you guys fill the secondary bucket (with the tap) with the starsan fluid the day of bottling?
I can sanitize the bucket, then spill some into the bottle washer then sanitize the syphon tube before emptying the bucket and putting the batch prime in before syphoning in the beer just before bottling?
Paul
I would tend to immerse the siphon tube, tap, and bottling wand in sanitising solution.
You have the right idea to use the bottle washer jet to force clean the siphon tube.
I would not use an awful lot of star san solution for the bottling bucket - some people just keep some in a kitchen spray bottle.
You are pretty much there with good technique.
I do something very similar with DIY bleach/vinegar sanitiser but I think residual bleach is killing the head in my beers, so I will be picking up some star san on my next purchase.
Paul, as TheSumOfAllBeers said, you only need a spray bottle or a few 100ml to slosh around the bucket. Contact time to kill is about 30seconds so sanitising doesnt take long at all. You should put a dip tube in your bottling bucket and youll reduce losses to <50ml per batch. Also you can put a second bottling wand on the bottling bucket and it speeds up bottling day dramatically. Takes me about 20mins to bottle batch with 2 bottling wands. Check out 'Double Barrel Bottling' on HBT by a guy called Passedpawn, its ingenious
Lars what's HBT?
Home brew talk:
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/search.php?searchid=21892911
Quote from: RichC on October 31, 2013, 07:28:18 PM
Also you can put a second bottling wand on the bottling bucket and it speeds up bottling day dramatically. Takes me about 20mins to bottle batch with 2 bottling wands. Check out 'Double Barrel Bottling' on HBT by a guy called Passedpawn, its ingenious
This is what I love about brewing forums - ingenious, simple advice like this.
Just bottled last night, and this would help a lot. No shortage of bottling wands or siphons in my house.
Hi lads
Got 4 corney kegs of alexale. Have to say there in very good nick,but have being bottling for a while and sterilising them with V.W.P, and me bottles are fine, But Im wondering about the kegs cause on the internet these guys are all using star/sun.can anyone advise please ?
Regards