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General Discussions => Chit Chat => Topic started by: Beerbuddha on January 20, 2015, 11:32:11 PM

Title: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Beerbuddha on January 20, 2015, 11:32:11 PM
What are your taughts ?

I had 4 glass fermenters but down to two due to helpers with torque deficiency syndrome.

It's nice to see everything with glass but...dangerous(when dropped)...hard to clean....expensive
And I'm thinking with ales stouts I have to use blow off tube due to space in carboys which  looses allot yeast...which I'm not sure is good or bad thing.

My two cent. Yours ?

Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on January 20, 2015, 11:43:07 PM
I like carboys but I find glass a bit more hassle than I can be bothered with. So I've one glass carboy and a couple of PET ones and some buckets. PET carboys are my preference. I dislike bucket lids and I really like being able to see whats going on in my beer. PET is just a bit easier and safer than glass.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Beerbuddha on January 20, 2015, 11:46:12 PM
Best of both worlds!

Why can't buckets be clear plastic.

Glass last longer but no idea payback v plastic.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on January 20, 2015, 11:54:11 PM
Thats another reason I like the PET carboys, might not last as long as glass but I'm terrible for scratching my buckets.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Beerbuddha on January 21, 2015, 12:23:06 AM
I got carboy handles but can't help fear the neck cracks ......carboy smashes.. making mince of one's ankle.

I think carboys are just an accident waiting to happen.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Beerbuddha on January 21, 2015, 12:27:40 AM
If certain cleaning compounds are left in carboys for extended periods it's harder to clean the solidified cleaner solution on the glass than the original yeast cake.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on January 21, 2015, 01:15:19 AM
I'm gonna build a carboy washer once the weather gets decent and I'm cleaning outside again. Looks easy and very handy once it's done.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Sorcerers Apprentice on January 21, 2015, 08:39:28 AM
Standard industrial practice is to leave 25% headspace in the fermenters ie only fill to 75% however the krausen floating on top isn't doing much work converting sugars so whether it's sitting in a blow off vessel or floating I can't see any difference. The burton union system actually works on this principle and the yeast collected in the blow off is used to pitch the next brew
Regarding cleaning I picked up one of those Lidl submersible pumps to make a keg/carboy cleaner myself, when I can get around to it
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Rossa on January 21, 2015, 09:45:11 AM
You can't bait a bit of ss. Easy to clean, hard to scratch. They can be heavy though...but won't break.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Hop Bomb on January 21, 2015, 01:44:52 PM
I love the plastic PET carboys that the vintage shop make. The only draw back I see is they scratch easy but if you dont use anything to clean internally that issue is greatly reduced (soak & rinse to clean). Ive 6 of em & 2 glass ones & the glass ones never get used anymore. I can fit 4 plastic carboys in my ferm fridge. They're easy enough lift when full. Cleaning is handy with warm water & brewers caustic (oxy would do the same) The crud just falls off. They're cheap too & for aging beers they're supposed to give the closest amount of oxygen permeation (correct term?) as a cask if they're pretty full & have a carboy cap on with both ports sealed. You can see fermentation take place in em too which is class (cant see a thing with stainless). 



Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: molc on January 21, 2015, 02:19:30 PM
How many litres can you get into a 19/20L carboy for fermenting, leaving enough head-space for Kreustan?I got one of the 19L carboys from the homebrew company(https://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/19-litre-carboy-with-tap-p-1772.html) for doing secondary on my big beers.

By my calculations, I'd only get about 16L into it if I was reserving enough space. That doesn't even fill a keg, yet alone a few bottles on the side, which makes it a bit useless for fermenting a batch.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Pheeel on January 21, 2015, 02:20:22 PM
I have a glass Big Mouth Bubbler. Best carboy I own. They have glass and plastic versions. Not sure if you can get them here though....
http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/brewing/brewing-equipment/fermenting-equipment/big-mouth-bubbler
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Hop Bomb on January 21, 2015, 03:21:47 PM
Quote from: molc on January 21, 2015, 02:19:30 PM
How many litres can you get into a 19/20L carboy for fermenting, leaving enough head-space for Kreustan?I got one of the 19L carboys from the homebrew company(https://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/19-litre-carboy-with-tap-p-1772.html) for doing secondary on my big beers.

By my calculations, I'd only get about 16L into it if I was reserving enough space. That doesn't even fill a keg, yet alone a few bottles on the side, which makes it a bit useless for fermenting a batch.

They're 6 US gallon / 23 litre carboys!! I get one full corny out of every PET carboy without even touching the beer on the yeast cake. Il useless you! Close the door behind you  :P
http://www.homebrewwest.ie/brouwland-quality-pet-carboy-23-litres-with-bung-and-airlock-3278-p.asp

Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: molc on January 21, 2015, 03:26:37 PM
Quote from: Hop Bomb on January 21, 2015, 03:21:47 PM
Il useless you! Close the door behind you  :P

Haha, I meant MY carboy was useless :P Those look the business though - thanks for the link. Will pick one up the next time I put in a HBW order, so I can oggle my beer as it ferments.

Just to check, you fill them with about 20L of beer?
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on January 21, 2015, 03:26:57 PM
Thats the one I use too. I think I'll buy more soon, I want to get a lot of stuff on this summer and I'd rather avoid buckets altogether.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Hop Bomb on January 21, 2015, 03:35:20 PM
Its 19 litres to the top of the sticker on the carboy there approx. I fill em up to the shoulder. Only big beers blow off big time. Any regular OG beers just bubble away nicely.

(http://i.imgur.com/J6POiCpl.jpg)
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Beerbuddha on January 21, 2015, 07:33:46 PM
I might order some of those myself.
32€ not too cheap but at least they say indestructible !
Btw hop bomb you have enough beer in that fridge to get an army twisted.

Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Vermelho on January 21, 2015, 08:13:24 PM
Quote from: Hop Bomb on January 21, 2015, 03:21:47 PM
Quote from: molc on January 21, 2015, 02:19:30 PM
How many litres can you get into a 19/20L carboy for fermenting, leaving enough head-space for Kreustan?I got one of the 19L carboys from the homebrew company(https://www.thehomebrewcompany.ie/19-litre-carboy-with-tap-p-1772.html) for doing secondary on my big beers.

By my calculations, I'd only get about 16L into it if I was reserving enough space. That doesn't even fill a keg, yet alone a few bottles on the side, which makes it a bit useless for fermenting a batch.

They're 6 US gallon / 23 litre carboys!! I get one full corny out of every PET carboy without even touching the beer on the yeast cake. Il useless you! Close the door behind you  :P
http://www.homebrewwest.ie/brouwland-quality-pet-carboy-23-litres-with-bung-and-airlock-3278-p.asp

How do you clean them? Just put some PBW in for 30 mins with some vigorous shaking?
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Hop Bomb on January 21, 2015, 08:28:32 PM
I use half litre of brewers caustic in 23 litres hot water. No shaking needed. Just rinse twice after that & then sanitize with starsan. Oxy from lidl & pbw will do the same job. PBW will do a better job than oxy as it wont leave a chalky residue on it (its not an issue - just something to do with hard water) You need to minimize contact time with your cleaning solution so dont leave it over night. 30 mins is enough. You can see the crud falling off.

I got mine on sale at geterbrewed during the summer. They were 20e each I think.  They have em for 28e now not incl your discount  http://geterbrewed.ie/pet-carboy-23-litre-with-rubber-bung-and-airlock.html

I have many thirsty friends. Kegs disappear quick!
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on January 21, 2015, 09:07:26 PM
What do you do for taking gravity readings with no tap? Do you stick a syphon in the second hole in the bung?

I have to say I like the look of those transparent fermenters. Nice to see what's going on inside
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: johnrm on January 21, 2015, 09:10:23 PM
You could sanitize your hydrometer, then gently drop or into your fermenter.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: johnrm on January 21, 2015, 09:11:33 PM
Scratch that, I see it's for carboys...
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: armedcor on January 21, 2015, 09:25:00 PM
Quote from: Kevin Roundwood on January 21, 2015, 09:07:26 PM
What do you do for taking gravity readings with no tap? Do you stick a syphon in the second hole in the bung?

I have to say I like the look of those transparent fermenters. Nice to see what's going on inside

Wine thief or if you're cheap like me a turkey baster.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Hop Bomb on January 21, 2015, 09:43:04 PM
Ive two of those wine thieves that the same company makes. One for clean & one for sour. You leave a hydrometer inside them too so you take readings without a trial jar. Ive a broken corny that all that stuff like racking canes etc sits in with sanitizer. http://www.homebrewwest.ie/wine-thief-sampler--jar-in-1-2266-p.asp  Handy yokes. None of the sour gear ever comes into contact with clean beer gear.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on January 21, 2015, 11:40:27 PM
I almost never take gravity readings until I'm racking. If I feel I need a sample I use a sanatised turkey baster. I might invest in one of those wine thiefs though, they look very handy.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Hop Bomb on January 22, 2015, 12:31:46 AM
Some beers need temp rises at various stages of attenuation so have to check gravities daily. Its a bit of a pain but you get to taste the beer as it progresses.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on January 22, 2015, 01:33:03 AM
Well I'm using a swamp cooler for now so that's not an issue for me.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on January 22, 2015, 06:38:06 PM
Swamp cooler??
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: johnrm on January 22, 2015, 06:53:29 PM
Google is your friend!
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on January 22, 2015, 09:23:42 PM
Quote from: Kevin Roundwood on January 22, 2015, 06:38:06 PM
Swamp cooler??

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v507/darqs/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-07/282ECDCB-E2E0-4A9D-91ED-BB92815C40FC.jpg)
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: molc on January 22, 2015, 10:30:30 PM
Like all good beer everwhere, surrounded by tins of paint and bog roll:P
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on January 22, 2015, 11:15:38 PM
The paint fumes give it a special aroma.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on January 23, 2015, 02:06:48 AM
Quote from: johnrm on January 22, 2015, 06:53:29 PM
Google is your friend!

Not always John, not always.... :-[
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: molc on January 23, 2015, 08:37:42 AM
Is that why the ipa you gave me held the hops so well? Mmm essense of paint, the secret indegrient.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Jonnycheech on January 23, 2015, 11:31:31 AM
Quote from: Hop Bomb on January 21, 2015, 03:35:20 PM
Its 19 litres to the top of the sticker on the carboy there approx. I fill em up to the shoulder. Only big beers blow off big time. Any regular OG beers just bubble away nicely.

(http://i.imgur.com/J6POiCpl.jpg)

Nice fermentation fridge! Did you need to reinforce anything or did you just stick some hardboard in as shelving? I was planning on a new chest freezer but seeing this may have changed my mind, serious bit of space saving with the larder fridge.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on January 23, 2015, 11:32:19 AM
Thats it Molc, it forms a lovely layer of lead on top of the beer that seals in the flavour.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 03, 2015, 04:59:53 PM
I've been mulling these over for the last while - pretty much settled on glass carboys but I just read that you can't use your heat belt with them? Feck, I have two that would be made redundant plus the cost of rigging together something to replace them. In the schpeel that comes with the belts it says they can be used for 2 glass demijohns though - what's the difference?  ???

Gah - I might just stick to my Youngs buckets...
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: molc on February 03, 2015, 05:38:33 PM
I picked up one of the plastic ones after hop bombs recommendation and they really are the business when setup with a blow off tube. Light, easy to clean and can see the beer fermenting to tell when to move to secondary. I have my heat belt on it and it's happily chugging away. Total convert.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 03, 2015, 06:10:54 PM
Quote from: molc on February 03, 2015, 05:38:33 PM
I picked up one of the plastic ones after hop bombs recommendation and they really are the business when setup with a blow off tube


Why the blow-off tube? Don't they give enough head room or something? I was considering one alright... I've changed my mind so many times I can't even remember why I passed on them at this stage...!
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: molc on February 03, 2015, 06:21:08 PM
Peace of mind. 23L is a little smaller than a standard fermenter, so it's more of a just in case. Didn't hit it yet though.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: HomeBrewWest on February 03, 2015, 08:28:48 PM
Keep them (and carboys) away from sunlight and strip lighting though. Seems UV light reacts with hop oils to produce seriously bad flavors!
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Hop Bomb on February 04, 2015, 10:26:42 AM
Really? I thought light was good for beer. Just like plants  :P  The light bulb is on the bottom of the fridge there. Its the heat source. The upper part of the fridge where the carboys are is in darkness when the door is closed (only time door is open is to take gravity readings etc)
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: molc on February 04, 2015, 11:11:23 AM
Ditto.  Of course, I have a hard time resisting the urge to open the fridge every couple of days for a peak at the action ;)
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on February 05, 2015, 12:28:08 PM
Quote from: Kevin Roundwood on February 03, 2015, 06:10:54 PM
Quote from: molc on February 03, 2015, 05:38:33 PM
I picked up one of the plastic ones after hop bombs recommendation and they really are the business when setup with a blow off tube


Why the blow-off tube? Don't they give enough head room or something? I was considering one alright... I've changed my mind so many times I can't even remember why I passed on them at this stage...!

I don't usually use a blow off unless I'm expecting, or more likely encounter, really vigorous fermentation. I'd say that happens maybe 1 in 4 beers. A blow off is no hassle though.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 05, 2015, 02:40:13 PM
Grand. I relented and got one of the Vintage PET carboys in the end. Looks the berries alright. I don't have any blow off tubes so gonna see how I go with just the bubbler.

Are there some types of beers/yeasts that produce a more lively fermentation?
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on February 05, 2015, 03:06:39 PM
I just use a 3 piece airlock if I think there might be a need for an air lock then I throw a bit of tubing on to that if it needs to blow off, like this

(http://www.homebrewtalk.com/gallery/data/1/Ailockbo1.jpg)
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 05, 2015, 03:27:52 PM
Very clever....
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 13, 2015, 04:27:52 PM
Well feck it I tried anyway... About 15 hours into fermentation I opened the door of my cabinet to find a foamy mess(//)

Stuck my syphon into the bunghole (teehee...) and tis bubbling away happily into a jug of sterile water

Just a word of warning with these PET carboys - get a blow-off tube!
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on February 14, 2015, 10:41:34 PM
Hehe nice mess. :)

What's your yeast and OG?
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 15, 2015, 01:49:05 AM
Not sure what yeast - it's the HBC's Orgasm Pale Ale kit so tis whatever came with it. OG was 1050.

Yeah sure you live and learn - no harm done. Might have over-filled it anyway, just filled it to the shoulder, forgot to measure it beforehand. The big fella said i was being greedy! ;) He might've been right
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: biertourist on February 19, 2015, 08:39:31 PM
I'm sold on plastic fermenters now, as long as they're not bucket-types (just too much oxygen exchange and I'm not great at transferring to kegs in a timely manner after primary fermentation stops).

Totally agree about the plastic Big Mouth Bubblers or Speidel fermenters where you can physically get your arm into them to clean them; that's a definite bonus, but with a "bonus" extra cost, too.

When plastic fermenters get old, just convert them into dedicated sour beer fermenters and get more.  I wait for good deals on new Better Bottles - you can get them 2 for $50 USD on a good sale around here.


I still want to replace my old stainless conical for lager brewing someday; getting the wort off of the trub is important for a nice neutral and mellow lager and nothing makes that easier than a stainless conical; but I want to have more fermentation capacity so having a small army of plastic fermenters is important; especially when I make wine and am occupying a fermenter for a year or so.  Lager brewing while minimizing trub is just really inefficient with small batches and takes a long time during fermentation so I really want a single large conical to keep some lagers in the pipeline.  I really don't like any husk-derived flavors so I generally only single batch sparge my lagers and only with acid-treated water so I get less efficiency; I also add PVPP (PolyClar) as an additional kettle fining with my lagers to REALLY bind and drop out any polyphenols (that grainy German pilsner malt flavor) -that just creates more trub losses for me so again I need to go big with my lager batches or its just not worth it. -I've now got a Kolsh that is, to me as good and honestly better than any Kolsh you can buy including in Cologne (I'm not afraid of hops); it is to Kolsch what Trumer Pils is to German Pils but it involves huge kettle losses and lots of time which again means I need at least one big, conical fermenter or else I need two large fermenters -one to use as a "settling tank" -then transfer off of the trub to the 2nd large fermenter).



I also like the 3 piece airlocks as you can use them with blowoff tubes very easily but I don't like that really hot water cracks them; if they'd make them with higher temp, less clear plastic they'd be even better, IMHO.


Adam
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: dcalnan on February 19, 2015, 10:21:22 PM
I'd love to get one of the fast ferment conicals, they seem really good from reviews I've read, but they're not as shiny as the stainless steel. I'm still using buckets and haven't had problems yet so it'll be another while before I upgrade.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Beerbuddha on February 21, 2015, 10:25:57 AM
What is max temp water that can be used on these plastic fermenters when cleaning ?
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: molc on February 21, 2015, 11:32:05 AM
About 60 I think. It's printed on the box they come in clearly, so of course I've already forgotten :)
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: armedcor on February 21, 2015, 11:38:55 AM
Just ordered another one of these on thursday...I kinda feel bad...I have two of these now and both are used for sours haha
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on February 23, 2015, 04:59:47 PM
Quote from: molc on February 21, 2015, 11:32:05 AM
About 60 I think. It's printed on the box they come in clearly, so of course I've already forgotten :)

I've one in a box here and it says nothing on it about temps. Is your one the Vintage Shop type? Did you get it from HBC or HBW?
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 24, 2015, 09:50:09 AM
Mine is one of the 'vintage' ones and it came with a leaflet that says not to heat the water above 52 degrees
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: molc on February 24, 2015, 09:54:46 AM
Quote from: Kevin Roundwood on February 24, 2015, 09:50:09 AM
Mine is one of the 'vintage' ones and it came with a leaflet that says not to heat the water above 52 degrees
What he said. Mine was from either HBC or HBW and was a vintage one also.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 24, 2015, 09:59:33 AM
Got mine from HBC
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on February 24, 2015, 12:34:10 PM
Well I got no leaflet, though there is a good chance I threw it away without reading it.

There was a little rubbery sort of taste off my last brew though and my chiller had failed me so I drained the hot wort into the carboy and stuck it in an ice bath. Could be the source of my off flavours in that beer.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 24, 2015, 02:50:21 PM
It's supposed to be actually dangerous if you put hot liquid into them... They're not inert like glass or SS so there can be some sort of nasty reaction. So I hear anyway...
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Beerbuddha on February 24, 2015, 04:40:37 PM
I had noticed the rubber bung that comes with the fermenter stinks of rubber...obviously but worse than any other rubber bung I have used in past. Maybe this caused an issue ...
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Qs on February 24, 2015, 05:03:17 PM
Quote from: Kevin Roundwood on February 24, 2015, 02:50:21 PM
It's supposed to be actually dangerous if you put hot liquid into them... They're not inert like glass or SS so there can be some sort of nasty reaction. So I hear anyway...

Ah well I've drank a fair few pints of it already so it can't too harmful.


The rubber bungs do smell a lot but I've never had it affect my beer before. Obviously the stupid high temps here did the damage. Or it could have been the water that leaked in from the IC bursting. The whole event was a bit of a disaster. Still there is beer and while its not my best effort its still drinkable. And theres always next time.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Kevin O'Roundwood on February 24, 2015, 05:15:32 PM
Quote from: Qs on February 24, 2015, 05:03:17 PM

Ah well I've drank a fair few pints of it already so it can't too harmful.


Good stuff
(just check your armpits for any extra eyeballs later... and more importantly - let me know if there are!)
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: banjobrew on February 25, 2015, 08:11:51 PM
I'm assuming these PET carboys are grand to do a fermentation longer than 2 weeks? I've read they're oxegen permeable so the beer can go stale? I have one brand new that I never bothered with because they're more hassle than the bucket and tap. Haven't even had to touch my siphon either because no point in transferring to the PET carboy as a secondary when I get great clarity when bottle conditioning. Apart from seeing what's going on I can't find any reason not to use the bucket.

I'd gladly have someone tell me otherwise but until then it's bucket for primary, tap with hose to bottling bucket for priming and then tap with little bottler for bottling.
Title: Re: Glass V plastic fermenter
Post by: Beerbuddha on February 25, 2015, 08:19:05 PM
The buckets do not seal properly no matter what you do with them. Apart from applying silicon I guess