Dairy Disinfectants For Brewing Sterilisation ?

[Greg2013]

Did some window shopping locally about a month back  to see what i could get outside of the normal Milton Fluid, had a look in the local Glanbia store and this is what can be got easily for disinfecting in a farming setting;

1) Ecolab "Iosan" farm disinfectant, 5 litres,contains 2.4% w/v available Iodine, Phosphoric Acid content 34.0% w/w, 1 part to 80 parts of H2o. 42.50 euro @5 litres.

2) Ecolab "Sterichlor" Hypochlorite, contains 11.0% w/w available Chlorine at manufacture (as Sodium Hypochlorite), 114ml per 45.0 litres H2o (4 fluid oz per 10 gallons). 23.0 euro @ 5 litres.

The sterichlor looks like it might be a goer allright at that price, i know its basically concentrated bleach but at the dilution suggested it is still more potent than common bleach and at that dilution rate works out at roughly 5 cents per litre 

[Greg2013]

Remember this is all from the point of view of what can i walk into town and pick up off the shelf disinfectant wise that might be a viable alternative to the common bleach and or vinegar mix? 

[brenmurph]

weve been working on this for the past 6 weeks and have taken possession of H2o2. the professional stuff that breweries use, have used and will continue to use because its effective steriliser, cheap and is a no rinse food grade. it completly degrades to water and in diluted form it completly safe.

See the post about brewery disinfectant 6 times cheaper than starsan. its actiually 10 or 15 times cheaper than starsan.
The stuff in your post is mega expensive.
We are pating about 30 euros for 5 litres and it dilutes by 700: 1

Keep an eye on that post for more advice. we have been debbating this for yonks, key issue was safety in neat concentrations. We are woking on diluting to a level that is safe for storage. transport and mixing, the end product will still be diluted by the end user at 50:1. 5 litres of this should cost a fraction of any other product.

[Greg2013]

Brenmurph i said a month but it was actually just before ye started that post that i checked that stuff out in town, probably why i did not post about it because your post came up shortly afterwards. I did not realise that ye were going to be diluting the stuff ye have before people could buy it?

[brenmurph]

there is still a lot of NHC feeling about the safety of h2o2. The diluted form is still stronger than starsan and a fraction of the cost. In addition If anyone can figure a way to meter out .6 of a ml to make a 500ml spray fair play to them.
So theres a practical issue with metering, theres a practical safety issue with h2o2 at industrial concentrations in the hands of someone who may be half drunk while theyre trying to mix their spray bottle and so on.

H2os is available in chemists at a 3% solution which can be further diluted about 20 times. The stuff we are talking is a 35% solution that needs to be diluted 700 times.
Current situation is we are working on what form is going to work in practice.

[Greg2013]

TBH i think there is a lot of "oh we cant do that we will blow up the whole house" type feeling on here over this and it is screwing the whole thing up IMHO. I appreciate all your endeavours Brenmurph but in all honesty this  attitude that grown ass men are not intelligent enough to handle this undiluted is insulting( not from you mind). FFS boiling water from a kettle can be just as lethal if not handled properly.

[brenmurph]

I agree, Im still unsure why people think that starsan is as safe as washing up liquid :

from starsan sheet
DANGER:
Corrosive to skin and eye, contains Phosphoric Acid. Harmful if swallowed. Do not get in
eyes, on skin or on clothing. Wear protective goggles and clothing when using. Avoid contamination of
food. DO NOT
MIX STAR SAN
WITH CHLORINATED CLE
ANERS AS CHLORINE GA
S WILL RESULT
. Do not use or
store near heat or open flame. See label for more precautionary information.

[Eoin]

The measuring system in the star San bottle is what makes it pretty safe, that said the stuff itself is dangerous. My big issue was brittle bakelite type caps that broke on over tightening. I've replaced both caps with coke bottle tops.

Sent using a complex system of semaphore and ninjas.

[brenmurph]

excellent point eoin.

[Greg2013]

The measuring system in the star San bottle is what makes it pretty safe, that said the stuff itself is dangerous. My big issue was brittle bakelite type caps that broke on over tightening. I've replaced both caps with coke bottle tops.

Sent using a complex system of semaphore and ninjas.

That's fair enough Eoin, i can understand that and actually would agree with you re the Starsan bakelite caps, they are very brittle.

[Covey]

What about W5, why are you not using W5?

[brenmurph]

W5 is a superb cleaner / sanitiser, no dought about it. Im using it over a year and 100+ brews and not one off beer. The benefit of h2o2 for brewing ( we already discussed all the other household uses) is as a last minute spray to be sure effort spray around bvvessels, pipes, ladels, airlocks around lids, hydrometer, and so on quick spray into bottles before filling and so on. W5 cant be sprayed as it has lots of gritty bits in it. W5 also leave a harmless to health chalk behind where as h2os is completly odourless and environ friendly, safe on food and so on.

the evidence on 500ppm h2o2 shows it kills everything in about 30 seconds contact, w5 takes longer ( 5 mins contact time)

So summary w5 is a great/ amazing cleaner and sanitises but not as practical for many brewing taske remember h2o2 is a no rinse steriliser in the right dose / when mixed correctly

[Greg2013]

What about W5, why are you not using W5?

If that was directed at me Covey the answer is i do use W5 and continue to use it around the house. However as a sanitiser it is not as effective or efficient IMHO as something like peroxide,iodine,conc. hypochlorite etc.