National Homebrew Club Ireland

Brewing Discussions => Yeast Board => Topic started by: LordEoin on April 24, 2015, 11:37:32 pm

Title: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: LordEoin on April 24, 2015, 11:37:32 pm
*This sticky post is basic for now, but hopefully it will evolve with time*

Washing: http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.ie/wordpress/brewwiki/washing-yeast/
This is the process of separating good yeast from waste material in your trub (eg hop particles, break). The yeast can then be used again in later brews.
It saves money and allows you to share excess yeast with friends.

Slanting: http://www.nationalhomebrewclub.ie/wordpress/slanting-yeast/
This is allows you to make many small cultures of your yeast strain on agar and grow them into multiple full size starters later on.

Of course, all questions and tips are welcome. Lets get everyone the knowledge they need to re-use and share their yeasties! :)
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: Greg2013 on August 28, 2015, 02:33:33 pm
I recently put down a Roggenbier using a WLP351 Bavarian Weizen Yeast starter,i was supposed to split the starter and save a clean sample for future growing up,however i forgot to do this and pitched the whole thing into the brew. I have no real experience with liquid yeasts so is it still possible using the method above to save a clean sample once the beer is racked off the trub ? ;D

Once i let the diluted trub settle and decant off the liquid and am pouring it into smaller jars for storage what portion of the yeast do i pour and how much do i leave behind to dump ?  ;D

I should point out there is no dry hop in this beer just what went into the boil. ;D

Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: Will_D on August 29, 2015, 09:19:09 am
What I tend to do (but not always) is to dump the primary trub and take the yeast from the bottom of the secondary. That way there's a lot less gunk in with the yeast. Less need to wash it.
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: Greg2013 on August 29, 2015, 12:44:49 pm
Quote from: Will_D on August 29, 2015, 09:19:09 am
What I tend to do (but not always) is to dump the primary trub and take the yeast from the bottom of the secondary. That way there's a lot less gunk in with the yeast. Less need to wash it.


That's where i have an issue as i don't do secondary anymore,i used to when i started home brewing but not in about 18months or more now.  ;D Is there a good way to do this from primary WillD ? ;D
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: molc on August 29, 2015, 07:37:00 pm
From primary, sanatise 2L water or keep the end of your batch and stir into the yeast. Then put in a separate vessal to settle out, then decant from that to clean the yeast. Alternatively you can harvest from the bottle later but it's a bit of a pain to grow from the smaller sample.
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: Greg2013 on August 30, 2015, 11:29:31 am
Quote from: molc on August 29, 2015, 07:37:00 pm
From primary, sanatise 2L water or keep the end of your batch and stir into the yeast. Then put in a separate vessal to settle out, then decant from that to clean the yeast. Alternatively you can harvest from the bottle later but it's a bit of a pain to grow from the smaller sample.


How many times would i need to wash it before i can store it in the fridge ? I assume the more i wash the greater i risk an infection ? I like the idea of using the last of the batch instead of adding water and increasing infection risk further so i will go that route i reckon. ;D

Appreciate the help guys,might seem i am freaking out a bit but this is my first time doing this with liquid yeasts for real and i just want to get it right. I haven't used the Kolsch starter yet so i am crashing that today and will be splitting it in two,one half for storage,the second half i will be growing up again for use in the Rye beer,that way i can just dump the trub when that beer is done and i still have a clean Kolsch yeast sample. ;D
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: davebhoy1975 on August 21, 2016, 10:40:51 am
OK lads and lassies, I have a question for ya. whats the formula for the dilution of wort gravity ?

What I want to do is mash a small batch of strong wort and then freeze it in a few separate containers to use later when making yeast starters for my brews.
I don't have and don't want to buy DME and yeast nutrients when wort is perfectly adequate for use in yeast propagation.

So if I freeze a few batches of lets say 400ml X 1.060 wort when diluted to 2000ml what will the gravity be? or to be more specific what's the formula for calculating specific gravity by dilution ?

Thanks
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: Oh Crap on August 21, 2016, 11:42:47 am
Quote from: davebhoy1975 on August 21, 2016, 10:40:51 am
OK lads and lassies, I have a question for ya. whats the formula for the dilution of wort gravity ?

What I want to do is mash a small batch of strong wort and then freeze it in a few separate containers to use later when making yeast starters for my brews.
I don't have and don't want to buy DME and yeast nutrients when wort is perfectly adequate for use in yeast propagation.

So if I freeze a few batches of lets say 400ml X 1.060 wort when diluted to 2000ml what will the gravity be? or to be more specific what's the formula for calculating specific gravity by dilution ?

Thanks

Do you know what gravity you want to end up with?
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: davebhoy1975 on August 21, 2016, 12:15:07 pm
I would like my gravity to be somewhere around 1.040 but I don't have enough space in my small freezer to go freezing10 litre of wort. I'm too lazy to do a fresh batch everytime I want to propagate yeast. So my solution is to brew a strong batch that can be watered down later.
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: davebhoy1975 on August 21, 2016, 12:31:49 pm
I found this this formula:-

End Gravity=Beg Volume * Beg Gravity / End Volume so if I re arrange the formula to give me my starting gravity

End Volume * End Gravity / Beg Volume = Beg Gravity
2.0litre       * .040            / 0.5litre      = 160 gravity or 1.160

My maths is pretty bad so am I working this out correctly?
Title: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: Leann ull on August 21, 2016, 12:52:39 pm
Plenty of online tools but consider buying beersmith at some point, it will help you on so many fronts


(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160821/71eb63d991e481536ce2757943e3efcf.jpg)

Or on 500mls

(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160821/240a5c069551cf8f148e032afd454b4e.jpg)
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: molc on August 22, 2016, 08:43:33 am
What he said:) Beersmith dies all my brewing maths these days
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: DEMPSEY on August 22, 2016, 11:27:54 am
Quote from: molc on August 22, 2016, 08:43:33 am
What he said:) Beersmith dies all my brewing maths these days

That's sad,when is the funeral :P
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: SkiBeagle on August 22, 2016, 01:15:57 pm
On an even more sombre note than molc's funereal calculations...
I've seen a lot of stuff about pressure-canning wort for starters. Never saw anything about freezing wort. Does freezing eliminate the risk of botulism? Wort is just sugary water - perfect for bacteria. Pressure-canning kills the bacteria by elevated temperature and pressure to completely sterilise the wort, just as you would do in jam-making. I'm not sure that freezing will do that. It will inhibit bacterial growth but not eliminate it. Does anyone use this technique and how do you prevent some serious bug infections?
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: molc on August 22, 2016, 01:17:39 pm
Your bad people :) no idea about the botulism alas.
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: irish_goat on August 22, 2016, 01:39:20 pm
You can boil the wort before freezing and boil again after defrosting to eliminate any botulism risks.
Title: Re: Washing and Slanting yeast (re-use and storage)
Post by: SkiBeagle on August 26, 2016, 06:35:09 pm
True, IG. But boiling alone doesn't guarantee absolute sterility. Having said that, it seems that boiling before use will denature the toxins.
There's a very good thread on HBT about this:  http://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=563969
Not sure whether this reassures or terrifies - see reply #16 and #17.

Some threads on pressure-canning wort:
https://www.maltosefalcons.com/tech/starter-made-easy-pressure-cooking-your-starter-wort-ahead-time
http://www.themadfermentationist.com/2014/11/pressure-canning-starter-wort.html

Overall, though, if you have to boil it again, it seems like a waste of time. You might as well just boil DME and save all the hassle.
Boiling some DME seems like a much easier option, even though DME isn't cheap as malt. If you were brewing on a regular schedule, I suppose you could just siphon off some boiled wort, and make a starter straight away for your next brew day. Pitch slurry instead of having to store wort.

I'd be very interested in your experiences with this. Should we take this off into a separate thread from yeast washing/slanting?