Lacto experimental beer

[eanna]

It hadn't budged from 3.8 this morning so I put a heating mat around it and threw in another handful of grain. The level of tartness of the starter is what I would like for this one, so 3.7ph ish, but I'll keep tasting. The belle season yeast should then finish it fairly dry.

[eanna]

I was trying to research what was the lowest pH that belle saison yeast can ferment in, didn't find anything conclusive. Tom, did your experimentation show anything interesting about it?

[biertourist]

The German Ale strain has proven to be able to deal with quite low pH -treat the yeast well and remember that the rapid change in pH shocks it just like rapid changes in gravity or temperature; so slowly add some of the base beer to your rehydration water / starter.


-Good thing you used a mixed Bret culture because genetic testing has now shown that Brett Trois isn't actually Bret at all, but just a tropical-accentuating saccromyces strain.


Adam

[eanna]

It is down to 3.7 this evening and the whole kitchen smelled like youghurt. Had a taste just there and it was nice and refreshing but I would like it more tart. Its getting boiled tomorrow evening regardless.

Adam, I didn't see anyone online saying to blend in the acidic wort with the starter, though the thought had crossed my mind. I've pulled off 300ml to blend into the 500ml starter over the next 24 hours.

Pic is daddy starter with baby starter.

https://dumpyourphoto.com/photo/Z8rOV340iq

[biertourist]

Ensuring a good blanket of CO2 was also a good move for many reasons.  Most of the enteric bacteria that can produce the super disgusting smells and significant toxins require the presence of oxygen so a good CO2 blanket is good protection for really letting the lacto do it's thing while simultaneously restricting the growth of the bacteria that you don't want.


For what it's worth, Omega Yeast now sell a commercial heterofermentative lacto strain that's ideal for making berlinerweiss or other lacto-only sour beers.  Most lacto strains are homo fermentative and can only consume glucose/dextrose but heterofermentative strains can ferment the whole suite of wort sugars and can therefore be used on their own for lacto-only fermentations that result in more tartness.  The Omega strain is also highly alcohol tolerant, but I don't believe that it's very hop tolerant (shouldn't be a surprise there).


Adam

[imark]

Is the heterogeneous one you mention just lactobacillus brevis? It's hetero and hop tolerant I believe.

[mr hoppy]

WLP 677 is heterofermentive as well. Although I've always used it with S-33.

[markc]

White Labs 672 Lacto Brevis is heterofermentative too, took 1:062 wort down to 1:012 in 36 hours, PH was 3.7 and lightly tart, but, just where I wanted it. The had it in The Home Brew Company.

[Cahalbrua]

Has anyone tried using "cheese makers" freeze dried cultures like lactoferm to sour wort.they sell them in homebrewwest.

[mr hoppy]

I thought about it, but (at the risk of being repetitive) I've been very happy with WLP 677 on the few German sours I've done - as long as you only use a nominal amount of hops.

[Paul B]

Wondering what kind of pH meters you guys are using? Also any suggestions for a cheap small co2 source for flushing the kettle?

[eanna]

I just got a basic pH meter from Amazon. I kegged up this beer on Sunday and tested the pH again with my own meter, it was at 3.8 again. Tastes great, there's a corn/grain flavour off it which is not unpleasant. Overall I'm really delighted with it. I would try to go a bit more tart next time.

[johnrm]

Cheap co2 source?
Fermenting beer?
Other than that you are into either sodasteeam, S40 our regular CO2 cylinders.